/tg/Station 13

Higgin

Ligger is an embarrassing artifact of our 4chan days and should be tossed out as we have everything else from those days.

I'm not going to talk about policy issues when I don't even play but I do want to discuss this though. At this point why is it still called /tg/station if being associated ...

Higgin

I feel like handling it IC is more about immersions than actually preventing the word from being a escalation bait.

and honestly, as much as immersion and keeping play going is what I'm thinking of, it's already immersion-breaking and obnoxious to have the lowest-effort lampshade of real-life ...

Higgin

Also quick response to Higgans spiel with no quoting, does this apply to people NOT using ligger? Like if I use tail-dragger, or Ash-heathen, or Lightbulb, does the same ruling apply to me with the IC racism? seems like a one way sword that isolates a single word, giving it weirdly more power than ...

Higgin

We know that you are allowed to kill off crew who say the l-word.

The issue is whether security is allowed to arrest and perma and gulag you over the murder.

dodging the discussion about whether or not we just wanna be able to say the word or not here. transitioning means i can do matrix ...

Higgin

Harm is harm. Halo especially but all the cat2s and even flashes do a measurable harm. I think it's mostly a usability conceit that we say "people will be fine trading a few points where it doesn't matter for healing, are assumed to consent" because in 99.9% of cases it's true.

Ideally, we'd be ...

Higgin

sure, i would hang out on a lower pop mrp

Higgin

Upgrade this ghost main to full power.

Reasonable takes, happy to help, willing to learn. Has seemed to demonstrate all when I see him working with people, and dare I say it he's gotten more honed with his other community contributions as a result of seeing more as an admin.

Higgin

:+1: immediately. Xzero's been a gem.

Active, friendly and understanding in tickets, demonstrates investigative rigor alongside the intuition he's gained by a deep knowledge of playing all roles (nevermind command, sec, and antag - one of Manuel's best AIs and deeply familiar with the nuance of ...

Higgin

Short answer: an ICly responsible reason.

Long answer: I don't tend to second-guess this too much. If you've got trouble on or coming to the shuttle, or the reasonable perception that there was, and think it's the best call to get out of there sooner rather than later? That's your call. People ...

Higgin

My comedown on this is that the IC choice is the valid one.

If the BB says to their Brother, "join this cool outfit I got hooked up with" and the Brother agrees, that's fair.

If the Brother says to their BB, "no, I'm not gonna do that, let's get you back on track so we can do what we came to do ...

Higgin

the note change seems agreeable though it still points at me deconstructing part of the shuttle (I stress again, I was not on the shuttle or interacting with the structure of it during the incident leading to detonation , that should be corrected) and I leave it to you to decide if you want to ...

Higgin

[snip]

The mistake in my thinking here was in applying escalation policy straight to a situation where the laws were in play - thank you for clarifying.

[snip]

The reason I don't find against the borgs here is because as best I can tell, they had good enough IC for intervening that doesn ...

Higgin

Doesn't get appreciated enough for the incredible due diligence work he does behind the scenes on checking logs and participating in discussions around issues. Easily one of the most supportive team members and supportmins, and great to interact with on the other end as a player when he shows up to ...

Higgin

Both borgs involved did not attempt to talk or reason with me, instead immediately choosing to use force that was available to them. They also did not consider the fact that I was passive and even polite, did not attempt to retaliate against them, and only sought to retrieve my hard work regardless ...

Higgin

[snip]

Also, since when was it against the rules to RR a target??? It's within the rules I thought...
When was this change...
If it is within the rules then why are multiple players here saying it's not allowed in MRP. Did admins rule something incorrectly?

It's not remotely against the rules ...

Higgin

If it is for redundancy, then it is my mistake. The page says "Precedents & exceptions: Examples and exceptions to the main rules." I thought of precedent in a narrow way, but they can be examples that show how a rule is applied.
On the security policy the first two are reminders also. Things ...

Higgin

[snip]

[snip]

My problem is that I don't see any difference in how rules apply depending on which path with this. In both you must be proportional in the force you use and also the punishment. It does not seem right that you would be exempt from or held to any rule because of the chosen ...

Higgin

I am not a big fan of letting people go around with singular names. It doesn't really fit the setting very well tbh

However, if we do decide on letting people have singular names it shouldn't be up to the staff team to decide on which singular names are acceptable. All names should be acceptable ...

Higgin

A way to think about this might be that there are two paths:
-get revenge, follow normal escalation
-act as security, follow security restrictions

The issue we're trying to prevent is people getting revenge that might be more than what normal escalation and RPR6 would allow by acting as security ...

Higgin

It says "Players who choose this path are empowered to act as security in regard to that specific threat," but players are already allowed to retaliate for things that have happened to them, as part of normal escalation. Seeking revenge seems like something which is a sufficient reason IC as long ...

Higgin

Actually since it's a very similar subject, what does constitute round removal / RR?

if I'm an antag engineer for example and I need to kill the CE, does throwing them into the crystal and dusting them count as RR? Or is that a perfectly valid assassination technique? Is spacing someone classed ...

Higgin

[snip]

any thoughts on this kind of implementation?

on the code side, it'd just require setting a policy message to be sent on death with a possible toggle like Enforce Human Authority (so it can be configured per server)

I like it. I think it'd be worth a shot. People would also do well to ...

Higgin

[snip]

100% agreed on it being better storytelling and good courtesy.

I'd be interested in trying it with the NAME forgetting. That creates an interesting puzzle of what you can say without the name - even if the person is disguised and you know damn well who it is - and gives people more room ...

Higgin

Still against it. Doesn't gel here and will invite a lot of deaths with "but how did they know?" while creating an asymmetry around round removal (RR) that doesn't feel good.

The only angle I think for this would be on MRP where
5. Antagonism and roleplaying as an antagonist.
The goal of ...

Higgin

I will say that I would definitely support removing this restriction, but I would only do so if admins reserve the right to ask someone to change it if the vibes suck. I want people to pick a mononym because they're doing something interesting with their character, not because they're lazy and can ...

Higgin

[....]

Also, apparently SD spawns in more often than the other heavy weight antags, or so I've heard. Not sure why, it has 4 weight like most other heavies and the same requirements. Something something true rng, I can nerf its weight down if how common it is is problematic.

To shed a bit of ...

Higgin

*obama voice*

if you like your firstname lastname, uh... you can keep it

/s

I think the fears are overexaggerated, but honestly, I also don't think we even need to go* so small as to say "mononyms but arbitrarily grounded."

Why is that human named like a sound or a food item? Did they grow up ...

Higgin

3. This is a sandbox roleplaying server.
Keep IC out of OOC, and OOC out of IC. Your words and actions ingame should be distinguishable as an in-universe character, and not as a person playing a game. Playstyles that disregard all opportunities for engagement and roleplay can be met with ...

Higgin

it depends on variables like current alert level/threat, and how command wants things to be run, but generally the roleplaying aspect is important in that contraband is contraband and employees shouldn't be using it, especially those tasked with upholding the law. if it's evidence to execute ...

Higgin

[...]

Yeah, kind of. From a flavor perspective, security shouldn't be using contraband because... Well, it's contraband. It's something crew members shouldn't have that's not allowed on the station. Regulations say that security shouldn't be using it, but regulations can go fuck themselves in an ...

Higgin

[...]

In general, it's always going to depend on the impact of the item in question. Antagonists shouldn't be bringing items to the station that they aren't prepared to have used against other antagonists.

basically my feelings on it. turnabout is fair play.

can it get other antags fucked ...

Higgin

Light and cheerful presence, always helpful in ahelps I've seen and had - good sort!

Higgin

(going for bodycount with conversion antags also makes the Inquisition getting called in more likely, especially if help is asked for, though your mileage may vary)

*edit okay spellcheck "fior" is a word but bodycount isnt. 1984

Higgin

Prosocial tiding is absolutely a thing, but everyone can do it - it need not necessarily be assistants.

I wager part of the observation of assistants keeping the lights on is exactly due to there being nobody else in those roles to begin with. This proposal would try to address that by foreclosing ...

Higgin

kayozz wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2024 6:05 pm ...

actually i lied do this

(you should add these to the shitcurity entry on the wiki, they're great)

Higgin

A few other thoughts:

- Be in your department when you can. One thing that enables crime, ecologically, is the absence of recognized guardianship. Anyone can be a guardian, often heads, but it's your job, and you have the tools to do it.
- Don't just be a "little soldier" - that is to say, if there ...

Higgin

Have any of you ever had any kind of strategy as a Security?

[...]

I don't know if this is a strategy, maybe more of a defined procedures, but I think close enough.
You have anything similar? I really want to hear and maybe we will learn something useful.

Biggest things for me are ...

Higgin

also and this is a good one, if someone points behind you and says "WHAT'S THAT OVER THERE" you should turn around and look at it and not react to anything they do behind your back for at least twenty seconds

I do this with people hiding in plants and boxes, imitating an MGS goon is fun - throw ...

Higgin

my big concerns are:
this seems to make the events workshop redundant. if there are problems with the setup of that program, are they actually unable to be resolved? could the goal of this idea not be suited better to the tools already in place?
what would this mean for the other servers? i ...

Higgin

Note removed.

Higgin

what i'm seeing here is that you did some due diligence towards getting permission, they hurt you, personally, directly, and so you got back at them w/ security gear and the help of the rest of medical - after that, without cuffs and then getting beaten down, they ultimately end up getting ...

Higgin

I'm going to be looking for, if it was a borg misbehaving (non-Asimov,) people investigating first if the borg is connected or not.

Then, if the borg is connected, trying to get and fix the laws.

Then checking the AI's laws directly.

Then, say it's malf.

If there's explicit malf tells before ...

Higgin

I remember when I was at the code meeting and it was universally agreed upon that we need MORE antagonists to keep the game fresh and to make dynamic better. I don't think cutting half our antag roster is a good idea.

Moth has said this and that also designing them well + making them distinct ...

Higgin

IMO a huge thing to me, IE one of my personal biggest gripes, is trying to set up gimmicks and trying to be an engaging solo antagonist is nigh impossible because dynamic sees "oh the antags aren't doing much" and injects a ton of midrounds which really disrupt a solo antagonist's ability to do ...

Higgin

I'm afraid to say I tried something to this effect in a past life and, although I think it would have worked well, it was ultimately rejected on a narrow margin vote.

From a time of running it like this behind the scenes, for the most part, these were some of my lessons.

Relevant to admins ...

Higgin

the very first greytide round when a bug made everyone assistants turned into an orgy of violence and a spontaneous rush on the brig for basically no inround reason except for the absence of anyone else

the history of the role has included rushes on the spare being such a key part of roundstart ...

Higgin

Vekter wrote: ↑Wed May 29, 2024 11:20 pm
Higgin wrote: ↑Wed May 29, 2024 10:59 pm edit: i'd even go higher than 20-30 to like 40 or 50
What's the threshold for Graveyard Shift access?

MINIMAL_ACCESS_THRESHOLD 23

Higgin

yep. wanna be a no-job ronin or take the day off? visit your head or the hop. otherwise, enjoy your extra access, gear, and the comms.

edit: i'd even go higher than 20-30 to like 40 or 50

Higgin

Vekter wrote: ↑Tue May 28, 2024 12:08 pm Shut down Terry too and let's move to MRP only

Get a crazy Hetz box or something so everyone is on the same server, to rival the downstreams: Massive Roleplay

Higgin

absolute hard carry on manuel, great sense of humor and demonstrates a lot of growth into the admin role even just within our brief time trialing together - I've been away a bit recently, but I'm thrilled to see him on when I come back. admin he

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