Give all the heads an ID console in their office.

[Falamazeer]

All the heads already have ID console access to their specific department as far as I can tell, correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm fairly certain this is so.
They can grant or revoke access's to their department using this tool, which I believe is tied to their offices access.

But it's rarely used, because the head in question either doesn't know it, or would have to run all the way to the bridge to use the console there.
I propose two changes. you give each head an ID console in their office that they can use to promote assistants or transfer people at their leisure, they can already do this, but it's too inconvenient as it stands.
The second change would be to the ID console itself, As it stands, A head can only grant or remove access's that pertain to their department, I propose you add a wipe button to the ID console that these heads can use to restore an ID to factory default, Removing all access, titles, and names, so if a station engineer wants to join security, the HoS would have the option of removing his access to sites that don't pertain to his department, then manually adding the access's he wants him to have.

This secondary change would give the heads a little more weight to their actions, and autonomy from the head of personnel. as they would have the ability to strip a card should the need arise.

[Marflow]

I thought that only "ID Console" access on a card allowed any and all usage of ID consoles which only HoP and Cap have by default. Never heard of other head having ID console access in any form.

[Falamazeer]

Not the case, I checked, Here is a screenshot of a CMO ID in there as it is now, it's rarely if ever used, and this might bring it to the forefront if heads had ID consoles.

[Reimoo]

IMO they should just have a card wiper or something. On the spot demotions need to be easier to do.

[Falamazeer]

There is merit to that too, But an ID console that isn't all the way in the bridge would go a long way towards that.

[Subtle]

Well, I didn't even know ID-consoles had such a function. That's really quite useful!

However at the same time I feel it's already way too easy to steal all-access. Even if the extra ID-consoles were manipulated to be more demotion friendly I don't think we'd see them used in that manner; more likely just as an alternative station for handing out them sweet, sweet Captain cards. That said I'll admit it's a slightly unfair of me to assume they'd be misused. Call it an educated guess.

It would be utterly delightful to manage access within your own department if this works according to plan though. I'm torn.

[Falamazeer]

Well, I'm not suggesting every head gets HoP access, just change the demote button a little, and give the heads ID consoles so they are more likely to be aware of and use this feature.
Not the access "ID console" the physical computer ID console. With the ID console access they already have but didn't know it.

I've never EVER seen this used meaningfully and it's a shame.

[Subtle]

It's more about having an extra four or five ID consoles scattered around.

The single one outside of the bridge is already very difficult to keep track of.
I suppose it isn't an inherently bad change, just one I can forsee having a number of untouched consequences.

[whodaloo]

I don't think it's actually all that difficult to promote/demote someone to/from your department as it stands. You literally just have to use the console on the bridge, I think the real problem is that most head players are just plain unaware of this ability.

[Falamazeer]

Well, I only found it because head ID's naturally migrate to the second slot in the ID machine if you put it in first.


And going all the way to the bridge to do this is a time consuming mess most people won't want to do anyways, as far as extra ID consoles go, I'm really not all that concerned, because either the access gets leaked to half the station from the HoP office, or it never gets off its feet really.

[Incomptinence]

Maybe a demotion dedicated computer? Oh or a wall machine.

I mean the full ID console is meant to be used by the hop and captain and the rare cases of stopping an all access cascade revolve around catching them using the all access say making more of it.

[Falamazeer]

This is already a feature of the game though, It's just unwieldy, and difficult, with no hints at its existence, if heads had an ID console in their office, they might question why.
It's a horribly underused feature that needs a little help to get going.

[PKPenguin321]

I'd say I oppose this since it would make it even easier for cults/revolutions/shadowling hives to spread their all-access once a single antag has it. I love the idea, but it throws balance for those kinds of things off a little.

[Falamazeer]

Ehhh I think the consequences of extra ID consoles is being overestimated, We already have five right now, HoP, arrivals checkpoint, bridge, captains room, tech storage.
All access as a snowball effect is already a problem, this would probably actually help reduce it as it adds multiple people who would be able to strip IDs back down without needing the HoP who is either most likely dead, or the main source of the problem.


Still, I wouldn't be adverse to a stripped down Wall Access Terminal that could bring up the same menu for heads if it really is that game changing.

[Stan_Studnick]

I'd prefer if heads got a portable ID machine, perhaps one tied to their PDA? Maybe the captain and/or HoP can use an ID console to set the devices to ask permission for changes, or maybe just for promotions or demotions.

Having a full-fledged console for all the department heads would fuck up too much.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

I still dont get why beads need a departmental console, instead of using the Bridge one (Or, if thy're the HOS/have access, the arrivals checkpoint)

[TheNightingale]

If you're forcefully demoting somebody, what are the chances you'll be able to get them to the Bridge without them either running away, being dragged away or someone stealing your telebaton?

[Not-Dorsidarf]

In ss13, if you can keep someone down long enough to drag them to your office, strip them, and change their ID, you can probbably get them to the bridge. Cablecuffs are probbably involved, or call your depsec.

[Gun Hog]

This was originally my idea, but I got shot down several times. For me, it is not about forced demotions of people, that is a job for Security, not you as a head. If you try that with your weak little baton, you are putting yourself at huge risk. I am saying that a head should be able to modify the access of his staff within his own department. In this case, your subordinate would simply give you his ID and allow you to change it accordingly. If you have any reason to be demoting someone, you would likely have to involve Security.

Also, going to the bridge for this is not a viable solution. Something needs to change here, because no heads (besides HoP/Captain) do this, and no amount of saying 'Just go to the bridge!' is going to change current, existing player behavior.

[Ikarrus]

I'm the guy who coded department-specific access changes. I've actually been meaning to code this for some time now.

First, having ID consoles in the head offices can work only if they're special ones that only permit limited access changes per department as opposed to letting them hand out all-access (ie something the heads would use as opposed to the HoP)

It's already pretty easy to get all access and mass distribute them throughout the station, but at least any security breaches can be easily contained by controlling the three existing high-security areas (Security checkpoint, HoP office, Bridge)

Having fully operational ID consoles littered around the station makes this impossible and makes a gameplay-significant object far too available.



Secondly, letting heads demote personnel not in their department is going to lead to bad powertripping imo. Portable demotion devices might work, but don't let a rogue CE demote the Captain.

[Falamazeer]

Well ok then, give heads a wall terminal that lets them do what they can already do with an ID console. Job done.

[Ikarrus]

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/9940

[hanshansenhansson]

ID console in the HoS office removed the only chance of a daring perma-escape you had. Back in the day, you could get out of perma with two homies, break into HoS office and disposal out. Now the ID console blocks space-access. Also complicates break-ins to steal HoS stuff unnecessarily.

[newfren]

ID console in the HoS office removed the only chance of a daring perma-escape you had. Back in the day, you could get out of perma with two homies, break into HoS office and disposal out. Now the ID console blocks space-access. Also complicates break-ins to steal HoS stuff unnecessarily.

Breaking a computer doesn't take much - literally just a few tools. Screwdriver crowbar and wrench are sufficient to move it out of the way - it takes a little time obviously, but I'm not sure it's too much time.

[ChangelingRain]

You won't have tools in perma.