(Zxaber) Yobihodazine - did jack shit

[yobihodazine2]

When and where this incident occured (Game Server, forums, Discord): Server
Byond account and character name OR Discord name: Yobihodazine
Admin: Zxaber
ROUND ID HERE IF APPLICABLE:203933
Detailed summary: I was the CMO, turned acting captain, had to set up the engine before I could do any plumbing work, so I went there. Came back to find out they were gone, the chemist had one and he told me a random assistant plasmaman had the other one. I announced over the radio 3 separate times that I wanted my plumbing constructor back. I finally found him in the hallway building a thermite factory. I pushed him down and took it back, and the guy beat me to death. When I adminhelped it, I was told that it was okay for him to crit and leave me because I stole something from him? Anyway I was super mad so I cussed out the admin for not doing anything. Grow a fucking pair and learn how to accept when someone is right even if they're being an asshole about it.

[yobihodazine2]

If you are wronged, you are expected to handle the conflict non-lethally whenever possible, escalating in severity as the conflict continues. As the defending party the rate of escalation increases with you, up to and including violence, while the instigator is always able to respond in kind.

If a conflict leads to violence and either participant is incapacitated, the standing participant is expected to make an effort to treat the other, unless they have reason to believe the other was an antagonist. Once treated the conflict is over; any new conflict with either individual must escalate once again. If you get into a conflict again with that individual, they may be removed permanently from the round.

[yobihodazine2]

I couldn't even get a "give it back or i'll kill you" when I hit red health?

[Fikou]

Hi, please don't make ban appeals/admin complaints until the round is over.

[yobihodazine2]

it just ended you pedantic swine

[Fikou]

It was not ending for another 10 minutes when you made the complaint.

[yobihodazine2]

I'm on the world's worst computer cuz I gave the other one away after y'all banned me for 2 fucking weeks like a year ago for putting a guy in red health and I come back and this is how you handle your fucking ahelps

[yobihodazine2]

maybe I should use chatGPT to make myself less confrontational maybe then YALL'D LISTEN TO ME ABOUT INCONSISTENCY

[zxaber]

Right, hello.

So, scenario is an assistant is given a department tool by the department worker. In this case, Rapid Plumbing Dispenser, given from the Chemist. You, as the CMO, later reversed that decision. This opens a few interesting questions. While the tool was originally under Chemistry (and thus Medical) ownership, it was freely given to an assistant. The two of you each had a valid claim to own the item. So, to be clear, I am treating this as an oddball scenario where both if you can be considered the defending party.

From your point of view, you reclaimed the item rightfully with a shove and went on your way. Fair enough.
From the Assistant's point of view, the CMO came up and stole their project item they had already been given.

At this point, the assistant takes to combat to reclaim "their" item. From our (somewhat scuffed) escalation policy, you can use force when required as the defending party. In order for the assistant to retrieve the item, they need to strip you of your modsuit, which takes quite a bit of time. As they had no way to hold you still, the assistant resolved to use crit. What can you really expect from the defending party in this scenario? To walk away, go find cuffs, and then re-track you down?

Finally, the fight ends with the assistant having reclaimed their item. They then left you in medbay to be healed. However, that did not happen and you eventually died.

Spoiler:

It's possible you may have survived had you waited long enough.
[2023-04-17 07:44:19.051] ATTACK: Yobihodazine/(Jayne Swabey) Has succumbed to death with -85.8 points of health! (Medbay Treatment Center (85,105,2))
But that did not play into any part of my actions with this ticket.

During the ahelp back and forth, I sent the following message;*

Spoiler:

[2023-04-17 08:20:41.724] ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Zxaber/(Douglas Bickerson)->Yobihodazine/(Jayne Swabey): Alright look, couple things;
-
- I will not comment on the prior ban, as I have no idea what the senario was, nor the events that resulted in it.
-
- If you steal from a crew member, they can try to retrieve their item. They can escalate to attacking if need be. In this case, I cannot expect the assistant to have any way of restraining the supposed thief, so that leaves the crit status.
-
- That leaves us at the true ownership of the object in question. Both you (as the CMO) and the assistant (having been given the item by a job with access to it) have a vaild reason to claim ownership. Ultimately, in your position, I'd tear into the chemist for giving away apparently vital equipment, and possibly demote them.

I will admit, I meant to add in that leaving you in crit was not the correct action. I had re-written this a few times as I played out the scenario, since as I mentioned before, it's an oddball where both sides can be considered the defending party. But yes, I do agree that the assistant should have made sure you actually didn't die, even on the floor of medbay. That I left that text out went unnoticed by me until after the round.

You then responded with*

Spoiler:

ADMINPRIVATE: PM: Ticket #3: Yobihodazine/(Jayne Swabey)->Zxaber/(Douglas Bickerson): you're retarded i didnt steal shit fuck you

Look, I get it, it's a frustrating interaction. But when you start throwing insults at the admin, the admin loses any will to help you. I'm not going to encourage salting at admins when the ahelp doesn't go your way. At this point, the ticket was promptly marked IC.

I did continue my follow up with the assistant for their part in the fight. I would not go into details of that normally, and an admin complaint will not change this. If you must know anything, know that it was handled.

*For Admins; from raw logs; https://tgstation13.org/raw-logs/sybil/ ... 3/game.log

[yobihodazine2]

1. if he can hold me down with a table shove long enough to beat me to death with his fists while im in a modsuit, he can absolutely just take the same amount of time to take off the modsuit
2. so what you're trying to tell me is that, if we're taking this part of the rules into consideration "you are expected to handle the conflict non-lethally whenever possible" then why couldn't he use his words like I tried to do first? Are you saying that RP is non-viable action?
3. I was dehydrated I'm already sick of being angry about this
4. If RP is non-viable action then WHY DO PEOPLE GIVE ME SO MUCH SHIT FOR POWERGAMING

[yobihodazine2]

But I always go and break rule 1 every fucking time the admins don't see things my way which chronically fucks me so what the fuck ever I don't even care I just wanted something to get mad about it helps me live in the moment

[yobihodazine2]

you know what I think I just realized that I really wanna blame getting banned for 2 weeks as the reason I went back to my ex and let her steal my computer. I want you all to be more important than that bitch. lol.

[kieth4]

Hey man, you don't seem to be in a great place right now if this is how you're responding to this situation.

I'm just giving you a chance to calm and formulate your thoughts. Maybe take a night off.

If you continue to nonsensicaly ramble about your ex and your computer I'll probably be applying a few day cooldown ban.

It's fine to be angry and frustrated but the game shouldn't take such a toll on you really.

[Timberpoes]

Frfr

[yobihodazine2]

Well yall like drama and I'm back to start more shit with the authority around here so you're welcome. I'll make sure to remember this ruling.

[Misdoubtful]

This is a unique situation with how you've chosen to approach things in the past. That is very much kept in mind here.

No one here is looking to create drama at your expense.

No ruling has been made yet, this hasn't even been considered or looked at.

If you want to be upset, be upset. If you want to work with us to come to an understanding you can.

You're pretty angry about all of this, you feel like you got dealt a bad hand and didn't get support, I appreciate that, but I need you to be civil with us here in this thread so we can resolve the problem in front of you.

The choice on how you want to handle this is yours, but there is only one choice here that will move things forwards.

[yobihodazine2]

I just don't think I should get killed for taking back my RPC after announcing over the radio that i wanted it back, with me being the CMO who owns everything in medbay, AND acting captain, which means I'm his department head too.

[yobihodazine2]

The guy was making a thermite factory and killed me for pushing him down once and taking back the property I asked several times. Then he mocked me in dead chat. Assistant making thermite kills CMO for wanting the plumbing constructor. How much more proof do you need that he was being a troublemaker?? Could he have killed me for trying to arrest him for making an illegal thermite factory?

[yobihodazine2]

I just don't understand how some people manage to convince yall they can do no wrong. I own up to my shit.

[Vekter]

The guy was making a thermite factory and killed me for pushing him down once and taking back the property I asked several times. Then he mocked me in dead chat. Assistant making thermite kills CMO for wanting the plumbing constructor. How much more proof do you need that he was being a troublemaker?? Could he have killed me for trying to arrest him for making an illegal thermite factory?

I put this in the peanut thread but I don't think you're reading it, so fuck it, I'll put it here.

You know you can just make another plumping device from the medical lathe, right? All you need is like one sheet of plastic. That's it. You could have just done that.

[yobihodazine2]

I checked the autolathe first. No I didn't know that.

[Riggle]

The guy was making a thermite factory and killed me for pushing him down once and taking back the property I asked several times. Then he mocked me in dead chat. Assistant making thermite kills CMO for wanting the plumbing constructor. How much more proof do you need that he was being a troublemaker?? Could he have killed me for trying to arrest him for making an illegal thermite factory?

Valid arrests are protected by security policy.

[yobihodazine2]

Valid arrests are protected by security policy.

Ok so can we stop saying I stole it and start saying I confiscated it or is that too much of a stretch?

[Riggle]

Valid arrests are protected by security policy.

Ok so can we stop saying I stole it and start saying I confiscated it or is that too much of a stretch?

As stated previously in the complaint, this is more complicated than a simple confiscation, and can't really apply here.

!	Message from: Armhulen
	Edited to remove peanut post part of this. Remember, as someone who is not involved with the appeal/complaint: mentioning rules, precedents, or piece of evidence missed is good. Opinions, takes, advice, bad.

[yobihodazine2]

Forget it yall obviously don't have the manpower for this anyway

[yobihodazine2]

Zxaber sorry for calling you names I didn't really mean it I don't even know you

[Timberpoes]

We understand it's frustrating when admins don't talk about the outcome of investigations, even during complaints.

For the record, the assistant in question was bwoinked, spoken to, lectured on the rules and received a note for the incident.

Ultimately, there's not much to really consider here other than miscommunication. Perhaps Zxaber could have picked a better button than IC issue to hit when you started mouthing off at him. But it's honestly quite academic to argue since the other player got noted for this incident, so it clearly wasn't treated as an IC issue and this entire thing could have probably been resolved 20 posts ago through revealing that point alone.

We have no issues with Zxaber closing the ticket when you started to get cunty with him. Admins are under no obligation to talk to abusive players. We don't pay them and we don't require them to care about tickets where players get abusive. At any time they can close your ahelp and walk away. Any admin actually closing your ahelp is the risk you take when you get abusive in tickets.