A few different ideas to improve disguises

[onleavedontatme]

I think disguising/stealth is pretty weak in the game right now. You essentially need a gas mask+full outfit+stolen ID and then hope you never have to speak.

Just throwing some ideas to buff it out here to see if people like any or some combination of them.

1. IDs dont show the name in the title/when running around, you have to examine it to see who its assigned to (or have the guy flash his ID in hand). This would allow you to disguise as an engineer or something without needing a gas mask. People in masks/rigs would always appear as unknown like this.

Possibly give a message to players roundstart that puts all the names of people in their department in their notes (they'd know their immediate coworkers). Kind of like Hitman where its harder to fool someone of the same job you're disguising as.

2.Remove the job icon from the sec hud. I've discussed this before. It means you cant throw on a disguise without stealing an ID, and stealing an ID means you need a gas mask, which means you're supet suspicious.

3. Replace all the job specific backpacks, radios, shoes, etc with generic ones. I doubt this will happen but being able to swap disguises using just a jumpsuit would certainly make it easier. It would be at the cost of our dressup though.

Anyway, thoughts? Alternate suggestions?

[TechnoAlchemist]

I agree with the first part of your first suggestion, if you can't see someone's features they should be unknown, and examining them would let you know who's ID their wearing. Additionally, I think we should do away with the

X as Y when speaking. It doesn't really make sense, it should just be whose voice you're hearing.

What ID they are wearing shouldn't factor into what you hear ICly.

[Lumbermancer]

Didn't someone say they gonna code a holographic mask projector I suggested somewhere some time ago? At least that would fix the gas mask issue for traitors.

[Luke Cox]

I'd suggest making the voice changer an implant instead, and making it come with the agent card for free.

[Lumbermancer]

Wouldn't it be better if voice changer was built into id instead?

[onleavedontatme]

examining them would let you know who's ID their wearing.
.

You misunderstand. Examining them would only show the job they have. X is wearing an engineering ID/access card.

However examination of the card itself would say "this card is assigned to so and so"

Or using the card in hand "X shows you the engineering access card. It is assigned to X"

As to particular traitor kit, I'd rather fix the system than come up with snowflake solutions that wont help other antag types

[invisty]

1. IDs dont show the name in the title/when running around, you have to examine it to see who its assigned to (or have the guy flash his ID in hand). This would allow you to disguise as an engineer or something without needing a gas mask. People in masks/rigs would always appear as unknown like this.

Wouldn't it make more sense that the name people see is always the name of the face (as they know the person IC)?
You could flip this the other way and make posing as another person easier by removing the concept of "Joe Bloggs (as Mary Sue)" and simply have it say "Joe Bloggs" until an examination reveals the ID being used. There's a downside to this, however, and that is that tg is full of people who always play the same character and have been known to easily bust stealth-traitors because their meta-buddy didn't have the right hair colour or was wearing a helmet.

Possibly give a message to players roundstart that puts all the names of people in their department in their notes (they'd know their immediate coworkers). Kind of like Hitman where its harder to fool someone of the same job you're disguising as.

This is a good idea. Also, make new crew announcements by the AI audible over department comms?

Remove the job icon from the sec hud. I've discussed this before. It means you cant throw on a disguise without stealing an ID, and stealing an ID means you need a gas mask, which means you're supet suspicious.

The best thing for this would be to give Syndicate Traitors/Nuke ops a new item that sits in the mask slot and is effectively a face replacement. It could either be a smart item able to copy the facial identity of a person (maybe download the identity from a sec/med console?), or a dumb item that simply creates a new identity. This would be a great item to complete the uplink wardrobe of stealthy devices.

Also, nerf the examine verb. Make small items invisible to the verb from three or more tiles away, and tiny items invisible unless adjacent. Tiny items should have no in-hands, too.

[Falamazeer]

Ehhh, I'm not entheused about the idea of removing job titles from huds
Sometimes it's one of the few facts it's possible to catch about a person as they zoom through, people should at least have to go through the minimum effort to disguise themselves to get by. really this is only rewarding bad play.

and making the default for anyone wearing face protection completely unknown even with their id out is ill thought out, I'm sure it will be wildly popular amongst the shitlers, but is that the demographic you want to please honestly?

This is game breaking for the AI sec and heads.

[PKPenguin321]

1. IDs dont show the name in the title/when running around, you have to examine it to see who its assigned to (or have the guy flash his ID in hand). This would allow you to disguise as an engineer or something without needing a gas mask. People in masks/rigs would always appear as unknown like this.

I just don't like this, I'd rather have my name and job obvious and out there. It's more convenient all around and not worth removing for ease of disguising.

3. Replace all the job specific backpacks, radios, shoes, etc with generic ones. I doubt this will happen but being able to swap disguises using just a jumpsuit would certainly make it easier. It would be at the cost of our dressup though.

Now that you can just drag your backpack to another backpack to move all the contents instantly, this isn't as much of a big deal.


I totally agree with removing job icons from the sec HuD, though.

[onleavedontatme]

"Minimum effort" with sechuds is a full diguise, gas mask, and stolen ID. Anything less gets destroyed by the HUD or shift click.

[Falamazeer]

If you think a gas mask or ID is hard to get, we're not playing the same game, Intercept bodies from the morgue/chef/robotics, a PDA works the same as ID for disguises, Agent card can name you whatever you want, Wait near a bannana peel with a gasmask and your ID in your pocket, Find a braindead two seconds after round start.

Or just Don't wear anything in your pocket belt or id slot, and carry multicolored jumpsuits in your backpack,do you buisness, run from sec, get slightly out of sight of pursuers, swap jumpsuits on the fly throw a hat on, and run the opposite direction past them. Put your ID back on and ditch the gasmask, Mission accomplished.

Disguising yourself is already wicked easy, And fools all but the most suspicious.

[EmGee]

Suggestion: Make scanning a ID to a blank PDA add you to the crew manifest. It would be a small change that would make creating new identities easier. It would also make fooling the AI and crew manifest eying paranoid motherfuckers easier.

[Ikarrus]

1) I like it. CODE IT

2) I'm fine with this too. The extra room with it gone will allow us to move the loyalty icon to somewhere that isn't awkward

3)We can still keep them in the lockers as optional cosmetic stuff, but having the players start with genetic ones sounds like it would satisfy both the need for cosmetic choice and gameplay needs.

[Incoming]

Not everything that could be done but a start:
https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/10274

[hanshansenhansson]

3. Replace all the job specific backpacks

Please just do this for the sake of doing it. They are completely cluttering most lockers, obstructing vision of smaller (in most cases all) items in the locker, and you rarely see anyone using them. 12 spare job specific backpacks for two botanists is complete overkill.

[Killbasa]

1. IDs dont show the name in the title/when running around, you have to examine it to see who its assigned to (or have the guy flash his ID in hand).

I think someone else said this already, but you can make it so people that are far can only see the job while people that are closer can also see the name.

Possibly give a message to players roundstart that puts all the names of people in their department in their notes (they'd know their immediate coworkers).

You could just add something on the PDA so that you can filter by jobs instead of a-z names. I dont know if something like this is already in, i don't really bother with all the features on it.

2.Remove the job icon from the sec hud.

I think this would just make it extremely annoying for officers more than anything, they already have to be worried about getting dunked or the latest IC drama happening.

3. Replace all the job specific backpacks, radios, shoes, etc with generic ones.

I can agree with this to an extent. I think completely removing them would be a bit much. Maybe have backpacks for each department instead of job.

[Tokiko2]

There should be a way to easily change your characters hair color to disguise yourself. I am aware of the semi-secret, difficult to get chem ingame but it only changes the hair color to a random one from a few preset colors.

Right now, it's impossible to disguise yourself as a generally known static character without wearing a suspicious full head cover because the mismatching hair color is a dead giveaway.

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Syndicate Hair Dye Applicator: Pick a color, or stab someone with the sharp nib to get their haircolor as a preset!

[MisterPerson]

Please try to focus on the underlying problems with disguising. A traitor item to make disguising easier is not a solution because it leaves all other antags SoL. Additionally that's just a lazy bandaid solution that doesn't get at the real problem, so it'll just keep popping up.

[Steelpoint]

Off the top of my head why not change some systems around so that, on a cursory glance, people will only see the name of what your ID is saying, and only upon observing someone (while remaining stationary for a moment) will you be able to tell if their ID matches their appearance.

It all really depends on how complicated or simplistic you want to go.