Nuke Ops War mode revamp

[Sealed101]

Nuke ops are simple: get TC - get disky - blow up the station. War ops are the same except you get more TC and the crew knows you're coming after 20 minutes. Not much of a change there. A lot of warops rounds go on the same scenario: nukies snowball over everyone or fluke and die. This is doubly so for the War mode. The challenge isn't as good.

My suggestion is: going into War mode additionally locks the nuke to a minimum timer of, say, 180 seconds. The disk is stuck in the nuke until it counts down to 30 seconds, and the op team can't unanchor the nuke once it's anchored. This makes it so ops have to defend the nuke from the crew reclaiming the disk and disarming the nuke.

This would bring a new dynamic to the War ops rounds - strategy over sabotage of the crew before setting the nuke to blow, where to place the nuke for a better defending spot, what gear to buy. The crew would also have more incentive to plan out their own defences as well as an offence plan in case the disk gets lost. Toxins or Chemistry (or Botany or Atmos if you are a gamer) can set up bombing charges, Medbay is a way for the crew to get back into the fray, while Security has better defensive positions and gadgets like lockdowns. On the other hand, Nuke ops teams would have to either throw a wrench into the crew's defence plans or prepare for an onslaught on the nuke's position, be it more ammo, tech, or even a mech or a shuttle turrets' covering fire.

Of course, some adjustments to the crew's time to prepare might be done as well, or TC bonuses, the nuke's minimum timer or even uplink items.

[nianjiilical]

i kinda feel like the bigger issue with war ops is that ops in general monopolize the round, and when war is declared it is essentially the ops saying "this will not be a normal round but you're stuck here for 25 minutes anyway" meaning people who dont care to engage with the ops have no reason not to kill themselves and go play runescape until the next round, since they know they wont get to do any long form station content anyway

[Sealed101]

this is an issue with any major antag, not warops exlusively. revs, cult, sometimes a wizard or an efficient murderboner - all are overtaking the flow of the round and people don't want to be a part of that round sometimes. i have a requested cult ban for example.

[Istoprocent1]

The change could be interesting, however, it would require a few more reworks in order to prevent it becoming a one-sided stompfest (a prolonged contact would lead to the crew winning most of the time - assuming 64 pop with 4 starting nukies, which is 1:15 ratio). Spitballing a few ideas.

Nukies need to be much more sustainable by having things like:
* No drop implants or a buff to make guerilla gloves no drop - warops is like 105TC, if one buys L6+2xammo (~30% of their total TC budget) and loses it to a random lemon explosion, then there is not much of game left in terms of offensive firepower.
* Start with Elite Hardsuits that have their resistances buffed (mainly against explosions, but probably lasers and bullets as well).

Crew would need to have less access to instant roundenders like TTVs.

Round might need a fixed timer and conditions such as instant red alert (unalterable by players) and automatic shuttle at 40 minute mark, which would lead to a 40-45 minute round (which would be around 20-25 minutes of intense gameplay) depending if shuttle is launched early or not.

Defusing the nuke would have to take time rather than just be quick 2 button presses. Disk could be locked in the nuke until 40 minute mark of the round (ie. when the shuttle is forced to arrive) after activation.

[Sealed101]

Not sure about a forced round time of 40 minutes, maybe lower. Warops tend to be fast paced, and setting the bar too high would lead to nukies losing more strength while the crew potentially gaining more. Some buffs to the gear could be a good asset, maybe even additional discounts popping up.
The TTVs are a problem of the warops strike force, as it's in their interest to fry Toxins to prevent any more maxcaps popping up. Maybe add more tools for nukeops to sabotage the station remotely or up the chance for traitors and nukeops rolling shift start.

[WineAllWine]

just remove war ops. Nuke ops work fine, add paranoia - 'the armoury just blew up, is that a nukie or a normal tot'? 'the AI screamed help and then comms went out - is that nukies?'

war ops is just -> declare war -> suicide

[Farquaar]

I like WarOps. There will always be a place in SS13 for lots of flying bullets and hallways full of corpses.

[WineAllWine]

I like WarOps. There will always be a place in SS13 for lots of flying bullets and hallways full of corpses.

Actually you're right, it shouldn't be removed. it is too frequent though. maybe lock it behind a certain threat level as well as pop?

[Sealed101]

its already locked behind 50 pop, threat locking might be a bit of an overkill. look at what happened with wizard events. but it does have some merit, yes.
the gameplay loop of nukies is still very bland, hence why i made this thread so we can maybe come up with some spice. tactical and strategy planning, splitting forces to attack/defend areas or people, defend/attack the nuke landing point - those sound like an actual war effort, albeit localised within a space mental hospital

[Valorium]

I don't see why we couldn't just add it as some kind of third variant of Nuclear Operatives - Stealth Mode, War Mode (more TC, advance notice) and ULTRA WAR MODE (even more TC and a few gear additions, advance notice, longer nuke defense).

Also I was under the impression that automatic shuttle-calls were a big no-no for TG design?

[Learner]

Here's an honest idea: what if after an announced war where all of the Nuke Ops are beaten, an announcement is played and Nanotrasen sends a restock of crew (aka one respawn) to encourage the round to keep going? This set it apart from normal Nuke Ops as War means people will die, and Nanotrasen wants the station to keep running.

[Likteer]

I am the smartest here, listen to me. Put the bomb on a cart and turn the mode into payload from TF2.

[Pandarsenic]

I am the smartest here, listen to me. Put the bomb on a cart and turn the mode into payload from TF2.

Actually brilliant tbh