Livestreamers and Streaming

[AIIA]

With the recent surge in livestreaming Space Station 13 again (there is someone streaming this with 3,000 viewers at the time of posting) I figured I'd ask the new term's headmins what their stance on streaming is and if they support livestreaming on /tg/station. This seems to already work well with Goonstation and the five minute delay on TGMC.

[oranges]

they belong on redditstation

[Misdoubtful]

What kind of delay or safety net would you propose?

[Mothblocks]

It's hard enough to find people who are metacomming, I worry about it being just as difficult to find who's acting on stream-exposed information, especially if the admins are not actively watching.

I think at most, a specific server that allows streaming would be okay, but as a designer and admin I am heavily wary of how it would affect the experience if everyone was able to.

I think TGMC is able to do it, but because TGMC is a fairly simple game--I also think TGMC wouldn't be hurt too much with allowing metacomming as a cursory example, but SS13 is just such a stranger beast. I am interested in what Goon does, though.

[AIIA]

What kind of delay or safety net would you propose?

With TGMC, the five minute delay seems to work wonderfully and I've tried to argue that it could in fact be lowered to something like two minutes, but TGMC is a deathmatch server of sorts and vastly different to the paranoia-filled vanilla experience that is SS13. That said, you could start with a five minute delay which could be lowered or raised over time depending on how this initially fares. I do think Mothblocks post above, specifically a designated streamer containment server, is also a good option.

[wesoda25]

What server would it be? Campbell I assume?

[Mothblocks]

Yeah, I think that'd make the most sense--its culture isn't really too formed yet, at least as any other server, though starting a fresh server might be a better idea (even if it doesn't have any pop yet).

[Mothblocks]

To add on, I think Campbell makes sense in the sense that MRP might be a better brand new player experience to see on a stream, not just because it's fairly low pop.

[technokek]

To add on, I think Campbell makes sense in the sense that MRP might be a better brand new player experience to see on a stream, not just because it's fairly low pop.

Watching a Campbell stream would be extremely boring tho. I would say terry because the rounds there are short and action packet.

[wesoda25]

Alternatively, what if we advertised “streaming” rounds or periods of time as long as a day/weekend? Or a streaming week would be pretty cool...

[Mothblocks]

That's also not too bad of an idea--something like "if you want to stream the game, contact head admins and we can set up a day to allow it". Only problem with that is limiting when people would actually stream, which will be on their schedule and not ours. That's not that big of a deal considering we've gone by just fine without streamers, but something to consider depending on your motivations for allowing livestreaming in any capacity.

The biggest problem to me really is that it feels painfully difficult to find out who's abusing meta-information on a livestream, but if the impact is lessened, then perhaps it can go better.

[XivilaiAnaxes]

streams are cringe

[Tlaltecuhtli]

it isnt a good game to stream

[Agux909]

Allow Campbell to be streamable. It'd be a good experiment.

[Atlanta-Ned]

Stream with a delay
Stream only on specific servers
Stream at specific times

Whatever it takes, streaming in some form or another neds to be allowed. This outright ban is short-sighted and backed by people who don't value the roleplaying aspect of SS13.

[JusticeGoat]

Cheaters often(not always) have other personality issues that will get them dinged and found out eventually. While it would suck to find who is acting on meta info, streaming would be good for bringing in fresh players, community's always need new people or they die.

[cybersaber101]

Keep streamers out of /tg/ as I can't find a single reason for us to have them when other servers are willing to host streamers.

[Denton]

That would make metagaming super easy, imagine the streamer being a team antag and half the station "magically" knows who the antags are 2 minutes later.

[Farquaar]

streams are cringe

Thank God I'm not the only boomer around here who still thinks this.

[Cobby]

I would be more comfortable with streaming on MRP versus LRP moreso because the focus is less about winning so you’d ideally have less sniping, at least from the existing crowd.

That said, I think we can learn from things like sseth’s video that you want to be very careful how you advertise ss13. If you advertise it like TTT but you can cause mischief even as a nonantag you are curating your future player base to bringing the game to that level of RP.

If for instance you only posted videos of wiping the station as antag, you can’t be surprised when everyone wants to be the next notorious murderboner if they came from your video.

If you are going to enable streaming, make sure it’s done in a way that encourages players to play in your ideal scenario. Personally I think there needs to be some features curated to protect streamers code side before we can discuss bringing them in administratively, and even then it’ll be tough because it’ll be quite easy to find the streamer since many places have unique sprites/features/etc.

[terranaut]

That would make metagaming super easy, imagine the streamer being a team antag and half the station "magically" knows who the antags are 2 minutes later.

solution: streaming allowed if you announce your intention in advance and cop a team antag ban for it so this doesn't happen

[Farquaar]

Better solution: Just record your video and upload it after the round ends.

Seriously, there is no possible configuration of rules that would make livestreaming SS13 on a publicly accessible server anything but a complete disaster.

[XivilaiAnaxes]

Better solution: Just record your video and upload it after the round ends.

but broooooo the C O N T E N T will be stale by the time it reaches the youtube!!

If I'm not receiving the C O N T E N T literally seconds after it is birthed into existence it's worthless to me

[mindstormy]

I could see allowing streaming (with delay) on Bagil as a good reason for its continued existence

[TheFinalPotato]

bagil exists as a outlet gate for when sybil players get burned out. nothing wrong with lowpop

[nianjiilical]

its hard since on one hand the simple fact that metaknowledge is so powerful means that watching a stream while playing needs to be actionable, but theres no real way to actually find out if someones doing it, and the easiest way to deal with it is just to not allow streaming

but on the other hand, people sharing the game with friends is ultimately how ss13 gets new players. i know for a fact i have a few friends in unrelated communities who are interested in trying it someday mostly because of me sharing screenshots and stories about it, and opening up the gates to some level of new player interest is a good thing in the long run

i would be up for designating one server as a streamer-allowed server and having the admins there know to keep a close eye out for metagaming but im honestly not sure how feasable that is for them

[Stickymayhem]

We've filtered the n-word so streaming is now viable. Allow it on one server and see what happens.

No one dies if it turns out to be a bad idea.

[remanseptim]

No one dies if it turns out to be a bad idea.

the streamers will when they are (rightfully) hunted down and robusted
delay won't save em either, once their static/name is revealed they'd be metagrudged to oblivion and would require special protection by the admemes
this would either have the positive effect of keeping twitch viewers off of the server or the negative effect of it attracting a tide of shitters enacting the will of their vidya-playing idol.
imagine the leafy lizard army or whatever the fuck it was but targeted towards tg.
the twitch streamers'll move onto the next fad anyways just bunker if they try and hop on and keep it until they go away, they really aren't the type of demographic you want in this game.

[cybersaber101]

Stream with a delay
Stream only on specific servers
Stream at specific times

Whatever it takes, streaming in some form or another neds to be allowed. This outright ban is short-sighted and backed by people who don't value the roleplaying aspect of SS13.

What roleplay, twitch chat going poggers? Streaming can be a tool to attract players through exposure but beyond that there's no benifit.

[EuSouAFazenda]

Just remember that if any big streamer streams a codebase all the other codebases are dead in the water.

People see streamer play the codebase, they familiarize themselves with that codebase via watching it and thus reject any other codebase by it not being like the ones they know. That codebase grows immensely with more servers, admins, features and etc, quickly becoming the objective best and definitive way of playing SS13. All the other codebases either die or get to a near-death state with only a minuscule dedicated userbase.

The only reason this hasn't happened in the Ssethtide was due to him keeping the codebase's name secret, something I doubt the streamers would do.
When SS13 inevitably blows up either we are the ones blowing up or getting blown, and I very much so prefer us blowing up. We all know it's a question of time til a chaotic-type streamer like RTGame or CallMeKevin discovers the game, streams it and makes it blow up.

We're /tg/station, aren't we? We're the kings of changing and adapting, of making hard decisions. We either live peacefuly fo a few more months or years and die out of the blue or we live a little less confortably and get to blow the other codebases out of the water.
Growth and new players are what keeps a MMO alive. Without streamers we'll soon be nothing; we need that influx of new players. This is the codebase that cut intents; we can afford to make an unpopular but utterly good change for the longevity of the game.

[cacogen]

The delay should be the whole round and while the game would probably benefit from more players it would also be more zoomer children gentrifying our once great state

[bastardblaster]

do we really want the type of people who regularly watch twitch streams in our community

[Not-Dorsidarf]

Just remember that if any big streamer streams a codebase all the other codebases are dead in the water.

People see streamer play the codebase, they familiarize themselves with that codebase via watching it and thus reject any other codebase by it not being like the ones they know. That codebase grows immensely with more servers, admins, features and etc, quickly becoming the objective best and definitive way of playing SS13. All the other codebases either die or get to a near-death state with only a minuscule dedicated userbase.

The only reason this hasn't happened in the Ssethtide was due to him keeping the codebase's name secret, something I doubt the streamers would do.
When SS13 inevitably blows up either we are the ones blowing up or getting blown, and I very much so prefer us blowing up. We all know it's a question of time til a chaotic-type streamer like RTGame or CallMeKevin discovers the game, streams it and makes it blow up.

We're /tg/station, aren't we? We're the kings of changing and adapting, of making hard decisions. We either live peacefuly fo a few more months or years and die out of the blue or we live a little less confortably and get to blow the other codebases out of the water.
Growth and new players are what keeps a MMO alive. Without streamers we'll soon be nothing; we need that influx of new players. This is the codebase that cut intents; we can afford to make an unpopular but utterly good change for the longevity of the game.

What about CrikenTV, a 300k+ follower streamer who played gooncode for a couple weeks a while back along with his 100k+ follower streamer friends, posting edited highlights to his youtube channel with 1 million subscribers. Has gooncode relegated us to the wastebin of history yet?

[RaveRadbury]

Allowing streaming has potential to be a great benefit to our community but could also be terrible.
It seems like the only way to know for sure is through a trial.

We have approved moving towards allowing streaming. For now I will be discussing plans for this with other interested admins. Be on the lookout for news about it!

This does not mean that streaming is allowed on /tg/station at this time.

Headmin Votes:
RaveRadbury: Yes(!)
NamelessFairy: Yes
Dragomagol: Yes