[MrAlphonzo] Gwei_lo_ren - The Punishment for an Inconvienient Ahelp is a Permaban

[Gwei_lo_ren]

Byond account and character name: Gwei_lo_ren , Ars Goetia
Banning admin: MrAlphonzo
Ban type (What are you banned from?): Main Server Ban

Ban reason and length: You have been banned by MrAlphonzo from the server.

Reason: Ban baiting and lies of omission in ahelps is bad. Whats even worse is excusing literally every single one of your bans as inconsistent enforcement of the rules.
This ban is permanent. The round ID is 110315.

Time ban was placed (including time zone): 2019-06-11 04:37:02 GMT +5
Server you were playing when banned (Sybil or Bagil): Sybil
Your side of the story:
I initially opened the ahelp ticket after a warden player (James Jameson) had begun to beat me to death after already having me cuffed and subdued- though he only got as far as to crit me nearly to death, the initial response I got was "You aren't dead so there's nothing I can do." Granted, he had subdued me after I attacked him with a sword, however with reference to the "security Rule 1 extension" this still seemed to be a violation of the rules. Thus, I began to press the issue as A) said warden player continued to use lethal means on me in situations where it was more than reasonable to use nonlethal- setting his egun to lethal while chasing after me, when I'm not only disarmed but CUFFED, and dragging me all the way around to medical to get healed (the Captain was the only reason he had not killed me already, he had expressed an incredible degree of agitation upon seeing Jameson clubbing me to death in brig as I was defenseless). MrAlphonzo, rather confusingly, ruled that because I had initially attacked the Warden with the intention to kill him that made it perfectly legitimate to use lethal means on me AFTER having been subdued and unable to fight back. AFter the Warden had finally decided to summarily execute me in the brig (Alphonzo justified this other action because I told the warden "suck my dick" which strikes me as rather ridiculous) MrAlphonzo decides to push 'banbaiting' on me- and not only that, but expected me to justify my PREVIOUS bans and then proceeded to punish me for said previous bans on top of his charge of 'banbaiting' (so much for "notes are not a punishment").

PM to-Admins: Rule 1 of the main rules apply to security. The only exception is that security is generally considered to be armed with non-lethal methods to control a situation. Therefore, where reasonably possible, security is expected to use non-lethal methods first in a conflict before escalating to lethal methods.

-- Administrator private message --
Admin PM from-MrAlphonzo: Are you really lecturing me on the rules I have spent 2 years enforcing?

A rather antagonistic response to me trying to justify my stance.
Why you think you should be unbanned: I don't think I should be expected to exhaustively cover every detail of the situation in order to avoid being accused of "lying by omission" OR that I should be forced to justify all of my previous bans on pain of PERMABAN. Calling this ban over the top would be underselling it.

[Gigapuddi420]

In the same section you quoted we also have:

Security Policy & Precedents

3. The 'act like an antag, get treated like one' part of Rule 4 of the main rules also apply to security. Stunning an officer repeatedly, using lethal or restricted weapons on them, disrupting the arrests or sentences of dangerous criminals, or damaging the brig, are examples of behaviour that may make you valid for security under Rule 4. Make sure players deserve it when you treat them as an antag, when in doubt, err on the side of caution as poor behaviour on the part of security will not be tolerated.

[LynxJynx]

As the person who nearly beat you to death there are a few important details about this situation that you have decided to leave out of this ban appeal. The first of which being you didnt just attack me with lethals before I cuffed and beat you, you ran up on me while I was dealing with an escaped prisoner and the 2 people that had broke him out. While I was trying to stun and cuff 3 people at once you came up beside me and stabbed me twice with a claymore nearly taking off one of my arms. I then start beating you and dragged you to the brig where I then came and healed you. You are also leaving out the fact that I sat there trying to reason with you and explaining that you had the choice between being perma'd, executed, or borged, because you had aided in a prisoner break and attempted to murder me, the warden. While I tried reasoning with you, you repeatedly told me that you wanted option D which was me sucking your dick. Then, you managed to get out of my grip and RAN OUT OF THE BRIG while i'm trying to give you a sentence. I then had to chase you down in the hall and laser you to bring you in because I didnt have time to change settings on my laser gun. You are also omitting the fact that you repeatedly said everyone hates me and I should just quit when I was asking you again if wanted perma, execution, or borging. You also said something about how you were doing the right thing trying to kill me because im a shitter that nobody likes. Just thought id add in those facts for you because you seem to of forgotten about them.

[NoxVS]

While I didn’t ahelp it at the time because there wasn’t a whole lot of proof and it seemed inconsequential at the time, I was playing in this round and believe this whole conflict was metagrudging. While he never acted on it towards me, Ars was immediately hostile to both me and Jameson as soon as the round started despite no interactions between us, and had been arrested by Jameson the round before for having a meth suicide bomb and was probably pissed at me for not stopping Jameson. That’s the only reason I can think of for why he would suddenly hate both of us and try to kill Jameson.

[Gwei_lo_ren]

While I didn’t ahelp it at the time because there wasn’t a whole lot of proof and it seemed inconsequential at the time, I was playing in this round and believe this whole conflict was metagrudging. While he never acted on it towards me, Ars was immediately hostile to both me and Jameson as soon as the round started despite no interactions between us, and had been arrested by Jameson the round before for having a meth suicide bomb and was probably pissed at me for not stopping Jameson. That’s the only reason I can think of for why he would suddenly hate both of us and try to kill Jameson.

If leaving out 'relevant' details is a crime than this guy is guilty as fuck. I was NOT arrested for having a suicide methbomb, I was experimenting with explosive triggers in toxins lab (doing my godamn job). What I was ACTUALLY arrested for being in toxins AS A SCIENTIST during a round where there was a gasbomber (already identified by the station). Once they (surprise surprise) found I had explosives on me in TOXINS (the user above rather bizarrely did not realize scientists work in toxins as he was breaking into my lab to valid me as chaplain, proclaiming me the traitor on sight AFTER the actual traitor had already been identified) LynxJynx decided to loot all of said explosives and haul me off as the bomber.

I will admit I was a bit than more dismayed to find these two in brig free to pursue their smoothbrain shenanigans- LynxJynx ESPECIALLY since in virtually every round I have seen him play security or command he ends up severely abusing the position to his own rather antisocial ends- I remember one round in particular where he was playing a security officer and he had ordered the AI "to arrest all assistants, and assistants are no longer human", after which round I remember one player commenting 'James Jameson is the epitome of shitsec'.

I then start beating you and dragged you to the brig where I then came and healed you.

You only stopped beating me to death one the Captain has taken out his telebaton and stunned you in the brig, witnessing you clubbing me to death. After which anytime you went rather over the top and used lethal means, with nonlethals fully reasonable to use you appear to have realized your 'mistake' and dragged me off in a comical game to cover up your misbehavior as if you were a toddler.

[MrAlphonzo]

No.

Cutting someones arm off and then crying to an admin when they knock some sense into you is ban-baity as shit, but you took it even further by complaining about your execution when the person executing you offered you a choice of perma or death, to which you just told them "Suck my dick."

Leaving out that you cut their arm off and that you were offered a choice of whether to die or not is pretty god damn ban-baity.

Ontop of this, your record has racked up so many bans and warnings in such a short period of time it is nothing short of jaw-dropping that you had the audacity to dismiss all your previous infractions as admins misinterpreting policy. Its no wonder your record is such garbage, seeing as how every single time any one of us has spoken to you, you thought you did nothing wrong.

You're a shitty player, and its obvious you have no intentions improving.

[Gwei_lo_ren]

No.

Cutting someones arm off and then crying to an admin when they knock some sense into you is ban-baity as shit, but you took it even further by complaining about your execution when the person executing you offered you a choice of perma or death, to which you just told them "Suck my dick."

Leaving out that you cut their arm off and that you were offered a choice of whether to die or not is pretty god damn ban-baity.

Ontop of this, your record has racked up so many bans and warnings in such a short period of time it is nothing short of jaw-dropping that you had the audacity to dismiss all your previous infractions as admins misinterpreting policy. Its no wonder your record is such garbage, seeing as how every single time any one of us has spoken to you, you thought you did nothing wrong.

You're a shitty player, and its obvious you have no intentions improving.

A) Didn't cut his arm off. Calling breaking the rules 'beating some sense into me' is a fucking understatement, as well. The only reason I didn't die, as I said before, was because somebody ELSE (the captain) stopped him.
B) Why should I include that? You've got the power to check the logs. Players shouldn't be punished for not being exhaustive enough for you standards, let alone antagonized for it. You strike me as remarkably hotheaded, I'm honestly amazed you're still an admin.
C) Why should I have to retroactively justify past "infractions" that I've already been punished for?

Frankly, YOU can suck my dick. I would rather somebody reasonable appeal this ban, not some lazy douche who's gonna permaban players for making you do the job YOU volunteered for.

[Hulkamania]

Hello, it's me somebody reasonable and i'm replying to this ban.

First of all lets clear some things up. No you do not have to justify past actions you've already been punished for to an administrator. However, your bans and notes in the past DO have a bearing on how we determine a punishment on our server. If a note is old enough and you have a clean record since then, we will overlook something like that without a problem. However, you joined our server in March, and within just a few days of playing managed to get several notes. Your count is now up to 15 notes, with 5 of those being from bans.

The incident in question: Plain and simple you attacked the warden with a deadly weapon as a non-antagonist and he followed proper procedure to take you down, giving you far more choice in how your punishment would be carried out than even I personally would. You could've taken the cyborg option and continued to play the round relatively normally and without issue, which is much more polite than just executing you without a word. The warden was very accommodating and you were nothing short of insulting, and you opened an ahelp about the issue to boot despite being the one in the wrong.

If your attitude in how you approach a ban appeal, the ticket, or even when speaking to the warden in game is anything to say about you as a person, you're not a pleasant one to deal with. Alphonzo is not a "lazy douche who's gonna permaban players for making you do the job he volunteered for" but in fact he's permabanning you because that IS the job he volunteered for. You did something stupid, and have consistently been doing something stupid, so he decided that the server as a whole would be better off without you in it. I'm inclined to agree and as such, this appeal is denied.