Station damage FNR

J_Madison · Post by **J_Madison** » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:15 pm #185269

Was on a round on Sybil, repairing damage.

And non-antags with the fireaxe just go around smashing all the windows. As I'm repairing grilles, someone decides to snip all of the grilles. Then crowbar all the tiles up.

Note that NONE of these people were antags.

Is this ahelpable?
I really don't want to solve this IC because it's killbaiting to griff and cause a duckhunt.

iamgoofball · Post by **iamgoofball** » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:17 pm #185272

kick their asses

call security, this is literally why we have them

Post by **oranges** » Thu Jun 09, 2016 9:34 pm #185289

Kill them

TechnoAlchemist · Thu Jun 09, 2016 10:58 pm

You can ahelp things like people fireaxing Windows fnr or cutting wires/sabotage fnr

ShadowDimentio · Fri Jun 10, 2016 3:53 am

If they do it once, punch them and tell them to fuck off. Hopefully they listen.
If they do it again, beat them up intensely. If they go into crit take them to medbay and tell them to not do it again.
If they do it at this point, kill them and space the body. They were warned several times to stop being shitheads.

Works pretty well for me.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:14 am #185405

Deal with it IC like you should instead of crying to the admins over minor inconveniences

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:59 am #185411

ShadowDimentio wrote:If they do it once, punch them and tell them to fuck off. Hopefully they listen.

He then proceeds to take fire axe and remove every one of your limbs, leaving a torso in the hallway.

HE ATTACKED ME I WAS JUST DEFENDING MYSELF, and sure enough from the attack logs, you did.

A faint whisper of valid... as you close byond to find another game to play.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 5:01 am #185412

Call Security...

Except there's no Security...

Try calling the admins.

Good luck mate.

Fri Jun 10, 2016 5:03 am

Zilenan91 wrote:Deal with it IC like you should instead of crying to the admins over minor inconveniences

^
harden up

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 8:05 am #185440

If it's a recurring thing, it is griefing.

Remember those round where the greytide would lift every floor tile in the station?

InsaneHyena · Post by **InsaneHyena** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 8:24 am #185441

This is what fucking security exists for.

DrPillzRedux · Fri Jun 10, 2016 9:00 am

This happens a lot. If you try and stop them as non-sec you get turned into a torso because HE ATTACKED VALID.

Sec is busy with antags or doesn't care about a window axer.

Then Bryce Pax throws his shoes at a grille and kills 3 people every time.

J_Madison · Post by **J_Madison** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 9:23 am #185449

Call it griffon, call it shittery, call it too far but I'm gonna start spacing people for this shit.

I call it negative reinforcement.

My concern is the lack of admins who're willing to put their foot down on something that becomes a chore to fix, especially as either role; if you're sec, you can't fix the Windows effectively, if you're engineer you can't stop the guy effectively. This takes two job's attention for one shitty player.

I think somethig needs to be done about the players that shit on the floor because there isn't a sign telling them not to.

Why the fuck are people breaking windows at roundstart anyway?
This is kill/banbaiting 101.

Post by **Archie700** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:26 am #185462

J_Madison wrote:Call it griffon, call it shittery, call it too far but I'm gonna start spacing people for this shit.

I call it negative reinforcement.

My concern is the lack of admins who're willing to put their foot down on something that becomes a chore to fix, especially as either role; if you're sec, you can't fix the Windows effectively, if you're engineer you can't stop the guy effectively. This takes two job's attention for one shitty player.

I think somethig needs to be done about the players that shit on the floor because there isn't a sign telling them not to.

Why the fuck are people breaking windows at roundstart anyway?
This is kill/banbaiting 101.

You are just feeding them what they want.

TheNightingale · Fri Jun 10, 2016 12:54 pm

They shouldn't be doing it in the first place. A non-antag even having a fire axe (unless there's a good reason like 'huge juggernauts in the halls') is shady; they certainly shouldn't be trashing the station just because they feel like it.
Dealing with something IC - i.e. robusting them - negates any possibility of OOC - i.e. bwoink - repercussion, and this isn't right. If you punch someone in the face and they punch you back, knocking you out, you still committed assault and battery.

Here's the solution: people causing trouble IC can be dealt with IC, but also OOC. If they try and fight back when people attack them for starting trouble, or adminhelp and go "Waaaa the atmos tech killed me and all I did was steal their axe and smash their windows and flood plasma", ban them harder. Nothing says you can't deal with something IC - the problem of 'someone's ruining the station' - and also OOC - the problem of 'someone's griefing'.

InsaneHyena · Post by **InsaneHyena** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:53 pm #185483

I don't say this often, but Nightingale is right.

IrishWristWatch0 · Fri Jun 10, 2016 1:59 pm

ShadowDimentio wrote:If they do it once, punch them and tell them to fuck off. Hopefully they listen.
If they do it again, beat them up intensely. If they go into crit take them to medbay and tell them to not do it again.
If they do it at this point, kill them and space the body. They were warned several times to stop being shitheads.

Works pretty well for me.

This is one of the few times I agree with you. Embrace this moment.

iamgoofball · Post by **iamgoofball** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:44 pm #185502

J_Madison wrote:Call it griffon, call it shittery, call it too far but I'm gonna start spacing people for this shit.

I call it negative reinforcement.

do it

cocothegogo · Post by **cocothegogo** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 2:47 pm #185504

i was banned for a week for destroying the windows in security so i'd say yes this is a bannable offence

Wyzack · Post by **Wyzack** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 4:46 pm #185540

Didn't Terbs catch his final and most permenant permaban for fireaxing all the brig windows?

Post by **Atlanta-Ned** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 5:57 pm #185554

Pretty sure a non-antag smashed up the brig's space windows during a cult round last night. That was a fun steaming pile of crap to deal with. More ahelps it is then.

onleavedontatme · Fri Jun 10, 2016 6:40 pm

>people consider broken windows grey tide now

Christ

imblyings · Post by **imblyings** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:02 pm #185577

Case by case

Depends on where and if it's a habit or not. No one will care if you break the windows to aux storage each time you log in. Admins will care if you get noticed breaking brig or bridge windows fnr and bans happen fast when it becomes a habit.

If someone is baiting by interfering with repairs and they end up critting/killing you etc, its baiting and we ban for baiting.

BeeSting12 · Post by **BeeSting12** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:02 pm #185579

Just tase them and put them in the gulag for 1000 points. 300 for posession of the axe, 300 for trespass(into the brig), 200-300 for vandalism(can even up it to sabotage) and 100 for resisting arrest. You'll find their burnt body floating in the lava, guaranteed. If they ahelp it, tell the admins what they were doing and be done with it. Ahelp it if it becomes a thing that happens a lot.

ShadowDimentio · Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:09 pm

Saegrimr wrote:
ShadowDimentio wrote:If they do it once, punch them and tell them to fuck off. Hopefully they listen.
He then proceeds to take fire axe and remove every one of your limbs, leaving a torso in the hallway.

HE ATTACKED ME I WAS JUST DEFENDING MYSELF, and sure enough from the attack logs, you did.

A faint whisper of valid... as you close byond to find another game to play.

What sort of unrobust slime do you take me for.

I've killed spacemen for less!

onleavedontatme · Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:25 pm

I hope you guys realize how bad making all non antag crime an admin situation would be for the game.

Anyone who leaves their workplace and touches anything can now be assumed to be a traitor and will promptly be dogpiled, searched, and executed by a bunch of bored security officers who were waiting for someone to do something.

Instead an assistant smashing window adds some background drama, a target/distraction for security and the AI, something for engineers to do, etc. That and the assistant is having more fun than standing in a hallway waiting to be shot or converted by antags (or sec).

I genuinely think tolerance of low level grief is healthy for the game maybe I am crazy.

A combination of strict bay rules for civillians and full on meta rules free death match for security/antags sounds like the most bland imagining of ss13 possible.

Who cares if some videogame windows that respawn every half hour get smashed? And the tiles are purely cosmetic.

imblyings · Post by **imblyings** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:42 pm #185609

Most of the thread is saying solve it ic

The sane posters are mostly expressing their opinion on how baiting becomes an issue when people try to solve things ic.

Xhagi · Post by **Xhagi** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:43 pm #185611

Probably take it on a case by case basis. Someone breaking windows just to be a shit but not causing too much harm? Eh, have fun. Hope you enjoy stunbatons.

Someone doing it repeatedly, killing people trying to stop them, breaking windows to space and causing loss of atmos in major areas like the hallways? Yea, that should be actionable.

At least, that's how I view it.

Cik · Post by **Cik** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:45 pm #185614

Kor wrote:I hope you guys realize how bad making all non antag crime an admin situation would be for the game.

Anyone who leaves their workplace and touches anything can now be assumed to be a traitor and will promptly be dogpiled, searched, and executed by a bunch of bored security officers who were waiting for someone to do something.

Instead an assistant smashing window adds some background drama, a target/distraction for security and the AI, something for engineers to do, etc. That and the assistant is having more fun than standing in a hallway waiting to be shot or converted by antags (or sec).

I genuinely think tolerance of low level grief is healthy for the game maybe I am crazy.

A combination of strict bay rules for civillians and full on meta rules free death match for security/antags sounds like the most bland imagining of ss13 possible.

Who cares if some videogame windows that respawn every half hour get smashed? And the tiles are purely cosmetic.

this tbh

really what's needed is a strong security with lasers rather than admin intervention

J_Madison · Post by **J_Madison** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 7:59 pm #185622

give us traitor without freedom to follow a specific order (so we don't go murderbone) to solve it IC and we'll see who is a dead man.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 8:26 pm #185632

J_Madison wrote:give us traitor without freedom to follow a specific order (so we don't go murderbone) to solve it IC and we'll see who is a dead man.

Literally never works ever, especially on sybil.

Couldn't even be trusted with a "don't die" objective during summon guns without taking that as the cue to throw yourself into a hallway full of guns to try and murder as many people as possible.

bandit · Post by **bandit** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 8:30 pm #185637

Wyzack wrote:Didn't Terbs catch his final and most permenant permaban for fireaxing all the brig windows?

No. It was the windows in front of the bridge, aka the ones that expose the station to vacuum

Sidon · Post by **Sidon** » Fri Jun 10, 2016 11:07 pm #185697

I agree with Kor. This adds great drama in the background for all parties involved.

DrPillzRedux · Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:51 am

Kor are you forgetting you can instacrit passerbys doing this shit with your shoes?

IcePacks · Post by **IcePacks** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:53 am #185803

DrPillzRedux wrote:Then Bryce Pax throws his shoes at a grille and kills 3 people every time.

two

the lawyer always survives somehow, and he's always my target

Post by **Atlanta-Ned** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 3:22 pm #185872

IcePacks wrote:
DrPillzRedux wrote:Then Bryce Pax throws his shoes at a grille and kills 3 people every time.
two

the lawyer always survives somehow, and he's always my target

You need to stop.

ShadowDimentio · Sat Jun 11, 2016 4:47 pm

Lawyers are like mimes or clowns in that there's a 50-50 chance they're either some newfag who doesn't know what they're doing or a grizzled oldfag who didn't get mime or clown and was slotted in as a lawyer.

Pilgrim · Post by **Pilgrim** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:57 pm #186000

As security I aim to throw this people into lavaland permanently. If I'm not I just catch them with a flamethrower.

Jacough · Post by **Jacough** » Sat Jun 11, 2016 10:59 pm #186002

A while back when a mime spent the entire round just harassing me for the sake being a shitter Kor gave me an uplink and an objective to kill him. Personally that seems like a great way to deal with people being shit on a lesser level. Someone doing absolutely nothing but vandalizing and sabotaging the the station? Select someone, give them some nice traitor toys and send them after the shitter with permission to do whatever they want with them (except rape of course).

Of course there comes a point where a ban is required though. If the guy's just constantly greytiding in the hopes of getting some valids and free traitor gear then that should warrant a ban. If someone uses their newly gained traitor status to go on a killing spree that should probably warrant a ban as well.

InsaneHyena wrote:This is what fucking security exists for.

Except when security actually exists they're too busy hunting antags to deal with people doing shit like breaking into chemistry to mass produce space lube.

IcePacks · Post by **IcePacks** » Sun Jun 12, 2016 12:26 am #186030

Atlanta-Ned wrote:
IcePacks wrote:
DrPillzRedux wrote:Then Bryce Pax throws his shoes at a grille and kills 3 people every time.
two

the lawyer always survives somehow, and he's always my target
You need to stop.

nobody needs to stop anything

security needs coder and player attention

Reece · Post by **Reece** » Sun Jun 12, 2016 4:00 pm #186188

Remove their arms.

starmute · Post by **starmute** » Mon Jun 13, 2016 1:13 pm #186431

Actually as a security officer I think the best way to deal with people who go around breaking things is send them to the labor camp.

Worst case scenario they admin boink

best case scenario they go to work mining the materials they messed up

imblyings · Post by **imblyings** » Mon Jun 13, 2016 2:34 pm #186442

no

remove their arms

IrishWristWatch0 · Mon Jun 13, 2016 3:37 pm

imblyings wrote:no

remove their arms

Reece · Post by **Reece** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:49 pm #187376

If they wanna break shit then give them a purpose, tag them with a chemical implant, and a tracker. Remove their arms, replace them with saws, muzzle them, stick hud glasses on them, give them riot gear and a full augmentation and a command headset. Hand them over to the HOS and make them his/her personal murderslaves, they don't talk, they can't talk, all they can do is charge at things and chainsaw them to death, once they're worthless use the chem implant to give them a expanding fireball mix on their final suicide mission to erase the evidence of your creation.

Until someone codes in replacing arms with actual weapons that's probably the easiest way to make some sort of servitor/eversor analogue for the jackbooted thugs to set on the people they don't wanna deal with through 'legal' means.

Not-Dorsidarf · Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:05 am

Reece wrote:If they wanna break shit then give them a purpose, tag them with a chemical implant, and a tracker. Remove their arms, replace them with saws, muzzle them, stick hud glasses on them, give them riot gear and a full augmentation and a command headset. Hand them over to the HOS and make them his/her personal murderslaves, they don't talk, they can't talk, all they can do is charge at things and chainsaw them to death, once they're worthless use the chem implant to give them a expanding fireball mix on their final suicide mission to erase the evidence of your creation.

Until someone codes in replacing arms with actual weapons that's probably the easiest way to make some sort of servitor/eversor analogue for the jackbooted thugs to set on the people they don't wanna deal with through 'legal' means.

Holy fucking shit that's metal.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:28 pm #187487

in practice they'd just kill you and cut off all your limbs and pull your brain into a corner where it'll never be found

Reece · Post by **Reece** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 5:03 pm #187551

Yeah pretty much, unless you get a shitler willing to RP as a literal eversor and take them to the abandoned tele for teleporting them to their targets it's gonna end with a really hard to kill shitler that you can only get rid of by husking out the room with his chem implant fire.

John_Oxford · Post by **John_Oxford** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:08 pm #187561

the fact that i've seen admins say that there is little to no democracy from players to admins (in other words, acknowledging the past "admin conspiracy") pretty much means that if you ever have a IC situation where someone is doing something you dont like, and they dont have anything that makes them a traitor, then this is SOP:

Malkevin · Post by **Malkevin** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 11:06 pm #187617

Malkevin's guide to dealing the greybacked shitlers
Or how learned to stop worrying and love the bwoinks.

1. Call sec - they're unlikely to show up but 1. it might make the piss stain run off, and 2. atleast you can tell the admins later you tried to get sec to deal with it
2. As you're waiting for sec to never turn up, gather the components and make a stun prod. Cargo, robotics, and engineering are good places to ask if the primary tool storage is raided already.
3. Grab a toolbox or other blunt instrument.
4. Find shitler
5. Apply zappy stick to their gnads
6. Swap hand to toolbox
7. Apply toolbox to their skull three times
8. Swap back to stun prod.
9. Repeat steps 5-8 until griffon is dead.
10. Give body to chef or toss out nearest airlock, do not get them cloned - they will hunt you down and try for revenge.

As sec if someone makes a mess of my brig I'll treat them like a puppy and rub their noses in the mess, that is to say that if they expose the grilles I'll throw them repeatedly into the grilles. Usually gets the point across.