Lavaland

[Lumbermancer]

Bottom post of the previous page:

Where in the poll is the option to rotate asteroid and planet?

[ShadowDimentio]

Miners should be able to go to whichever mining map they want to. Surely if we could have gateway maps we could have two mining maps.

[LordZalgo]

Additional suggestion, maybe a more accommodating infirmary could be added somewhere like the old mining outpost had. There seem to be a total of zero burn medical kits, which you would assume would be stocked on a mining outpost on a lava planet. The ointment just doesn't cut it on the fly; it'd be nice if the outpost at least came with a burn medkit and they were available in the mining vendors for the same price as the brute kits. Maybe even add both the burn kits, and a superior mining medkit stocked with 4 synthflesh patches, 2 stimpacks, and a health analyzer, and charge about 1200 for it.

I'd probably even ask for more, but then I suppose you start wondering what the rest of the station is for with much more than that.

[onleavedontatme]

Having two entire Z-levels for 3 guys to mine on seems a bit excessive, doesn't it?

I'm not willing to put time and effort into a redundant area or maintain two different forms of mining. I'd rather drop lavaland and try something else (which is why that option is on there).

[TheNightingale]

Half lavaland, half asteroid? Add an area to lavaland that has no monsters, no lava and no ash storms (like the old 'safe' area of the asteroid), but much less minerals, and no interesting loot areas. It's where the baby miners can go to train their skills before moving out of the kindergarten and into the scary lavaland zone. (Or where drones can mine!)

[ShadowDimentio]

Having two entire Z-levels for 3 guys to mine on seems a bit excessive, doesn't it?

I'm not willing to put time and effort into a redundant area or maintain two different forms of mining. I'd rather drop lavaland and try something else (which is why that option is on there).

>Maintain two different areas of mining

The asteroid hadn't gotten an update in like half a year before Lavaland came in and pushed it out. And mining should totally be made a public works project, like the greyshirts are allowed to get cheap space suits and mine if they want.

[TrustyGun]

Some weather suggestions:

Total Eclipse
The entirety of the Z-level gets darker, and deadly cold. Lava is turned into rock, and you have to stay by objects of warmth to live without the appropriate gear.

Meteor
A meteor collides with the planet in the far horizon, causing meteorites full of minerals to land on the planet (or on an unsuspecting miner..)

Flooding
A sudden increase in the amount of lava increases, costing new lava rivers to quickly appear. Unaware miners will be immolated in them..

[TheNightingale]

Flooding
A sudden increase in the amount of lava increases, costing new lava rivers to quickly appear. Unaware miners will be immolated in them..

There should probably be a way to work out which tiles become lava before it happens. Maybe if every tile adjacent to lava, then became a lava tile (except tiles with walls or floors on them, so the mining station/bridge doesn't get lavaified)?

[ShadowDimentio]

Chasms 2: The Second Coming

Please just make them summon lava instead of an /admindelete zone. I got dunked by them again and the salt is building.

[TheNightingale]

Summoning lava would instakill you too. You're fighting it in melee range, most likely, and each tile of lava you cross gives you... 20 burn damage, I think? That's per tick, so let's hope you're not injured from killing all those goliaths, or slowed down from watcher frost beams. The firestacks can't be removed by rolling on the floor once or twice; they take a while. So let's do some calculations...
... you're at 80% health, because you got really lucky and found a legion tendril or something. It disappears, and three squares of lava appear in every direction from it (you're standing on one). On the tick it spawns, the lava triggers for 20 burn damage, and you're at 60% health (plus firestacks).
You instantly run for the edge, and make it onto the next tile in a single tick... and take 20 burn damage, for 40% health (plus firestacks).
One tile left to go! You keep running... but slower, because you're only on 40% health. It takes you two ticks to get to the last lava tile... and 40 burn damage.
You're now in critical condition. A fellow miner could drag you out right now, extinguish you, and heal you; but if there isn't an ally who'll drag you out within around four tiles, you're dead.

Still better than a chasm, though.

[onleavedontatme]

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/16629

Proposed new lavaland station.

I think it's too colourful but I guess it's probably a better design than what I have right now.

[ShadowDimentio]

Switch the mini-medbay and the smeltery's locations. The medbay should be near where the miners come in dragging the dying body of their buddy from him having been goliath'd, not where they arrive from the damn station.

WAIT WHY DOESN'T IT HAVE A SLEEPER ADD ONE

[LordZalgo]

The proposed new outpost should just drop the smeltery completely in my opinion unless it's going to include an ORM. Miners only get credit for their ores if they take it to the ORM, so even having a smeltery on the outpost without an ORM is pointless. At best, they can mint coins so they can get cigars and zippo lighters, whoopie. Drop the smelting room or add an ORM to it and trust the miners to take back the refined resources, or create a new way for them to send it back without having to leave the outpost. Perhaps some kind of bluespace crate or a teleporting gun a la gooncode.

I see a toxin medkit in the infirmary, but I see no hazard in lavaland that requires a toxin medkit aside from perhaps spending a bit too much time in Gluttony's vault. Brute and burn kits are infinitely more useful, or otherwise just have a couple of standard medkits and make them buy brute kits from the vendors or go to chemistry for better meds. And yes, add a sleeper. Maybe a box of bodybags as well, just for RP and OCD reasons. I might even be the type to ask for a full surgery suite, but that's what station medbay's for, ye?

I like the current outpost tbh, and would only say that a third miner dorm and mining equipment locker along with a small infirmary would be necessary, equipped with a sleeper, a box of body bags, some blood packs, the two medkits currently kept on that corner table in the corridor, and maybe a burn medkit as well.

EDIT: I doubt anybody ever gets it, but the jetpack upgrade in the mining vendors only works with hardsuits, and does not work with the explorer's suit. May as well remove it from the machine at some point.

[Ezel]

Escaping gulag was never so easy with the proposed new mining station

[Ivan Issaccs]

An issue with not having hard suits. Gibtonite and hyper accelerators create areas of very low pressure and temperature, now if you have a self healing implant they are much less of a hindrance but still really annoying.

[onleavedontatme]

An issue with not having hard suits. Gibtonite and hyper accelerators create areas of very low pressure and temperature, now if you have a self healing implant they are much less of a hindrance but still really annoying.

I think I know the cause of this bug, but I have to wait and see if one of our atmos wizards wants to fix it.

[TheNightingale]

The ashwalkers can't walk through ash storms. I have been deceived.

[Wyzack]

Finally got a chance to play this.

Kor family it is fucking amazing. Like a whole other game within our spacegame. What it really needs is more ruins, even ones that don't contain loot of any sort. Just places to shelter and maybe set up a small outpost or camp. Also once a lava river ran right outside the prisoner ghost spawner area which makes it impossible to survive. In any case, amazing work this shit is awesome

[Gamarr]

What it really needs is more ruins, even ones that don't contain loot of any sort.

You are not the only one to echo this but there was/is a map freeze for some weeks preventing it. I imagine it will be incoming at some point, or hope so, with ash storm damage it's kinda needed too. Moving onto Free Golem issues now:
-You can use the land claim to actually make working rooms, however, new rooms (at least one adjoined to the shuttle, and thus running off its 'free power') came with no gravity. Shuttle remained fine, but new section was floatin' zone. Not sure if a separate room will also be grav-free, but I expect it to lack power too ...
-Which brings up issue of power cells, as I am not sure a lathe can produce them but I doubt it, meaning any new rooms will just be dark, unpowered huts if so. Give the golems 1-2 plasma generators please, if the depowered new rooms proves true.

[onleavedontatme]

All this map/balance stuff is tricky and tiring so I took a break from that today to redo pods with Ausops sprites

[Shaps-cloud]

Jesus Christ

[TechnoAlchemist]

No donk pockets or sleepers?

[Wyzack]

That literally looks better than any other location in the entire game

[lumipharon]

Looks neat, but it's kind of glaring how the style is utterly different from almost everything in the game (except shit like the new PA and ayylium saucers).

[onleavedontatme]

No donk pockets or sleepers?

It has both, worry not.

[DemonFiren]

You can't really drop shit like this without changing the rest of the sprites.

[onleavedontatme]

You can't really drop shit like this without changing the rest of the sprites.

I don't think Ausops really has the time or will to resprite all of SS13

[Zilenan91]

It would be impossible. It's why remakes don't happen

[Cheridan]

denying really good sprites because they don't match with the rest of the sprites because they're all ugly is a dubious philosophy

[Zilenan91]

If it was on-station I could see the point, but on lavaland things are kinda allowed to be different because there's not as much contrast.

[TechnoAlchemist]

Ausop's sprites look great and exist to inspire people to be better spriters and to improve the game.

[PKPenguin321]

my dick hurts

[TechnoAlchemist]

Anyways, two things. 1. Please move the welding fuel to the left of the O2 Canister on the main mining station.

2. Watchers shoot projectiles but you cannot actually dodge the freezing glance, I've seen me and a fellow miner both get frozen by one glance when were were on separate sides, blocked by walls, or by our ore crates.

[Zilenan91]

Yeah, basilisks have always had wallhacks

[Cheimon]

denying really good sprites because they don't match with the rest of the sprites because they're all ugly is a dubious philosophy

That's true, but it's not a straightforward "this is better" situation: there's a distinctive style difference as well that makes it jar with the rest of the game's art (except for the PA and abductor pods). If they're never going to all be at this level, doesn't it make sense to keep things consistent?

[Super Aggro Crag]

no it does not

[Wyzack]

Yeah, i would rather have better quality some stuff. Who knows, maybe it will inspire people to make more high quality sprites

[Oldman Robustin]

Grade A stuff.

Still sad that space has become almost meaningless in SS13. Hope that other z_levels get some love someday. Asteroid was a great place to set up shop as an antag without having to constantly look over your shoulder.

[LordZalgo]

All of my yes. Those shelters look absolutely amazing.

Also, my spelunking is occasionally hampered by the random generation of lava rivers. Perhaps a mining item that would allow you to set up a heatproof 3x1 or 3x3 bridge? That's how wide the rivers all are, as far as I know. Could probably charge the same price as the shelters or somethin'. It'd be nice to get at those tendrils that are completely blocked off by lava rivers, the only options being commendeering an atmos or CE hardsuit or getting an assload of burn medicine and hoping you don't crit in the river.

[Drynwyn]

Ash storms could use a longer build-up period- as is I've had a couple deaths when an ash storm sprung up while I was trying to assault a necropolis tendril, and it simply wasn't feasible to escape the mobs and set up a bluespace shelter at the same time (mainly because Watchers/basilisks.)

Speaking of Watchers they could use a rework on several points- diamond ore doesn't really make sense as a drop for them. It would be cool if they dropped a single-use Scrying Orb instead- it would help miners locate ruins and get a better idea of the lay of the land.

[LordZalgo]

Ash storms could use a longer build-up period- as is I've had a couple deaths when an ash storm sprung up while I was trying to assault a necropolis tendril, and it simply wasn't feasible to escape the mobs and set up a bluespace shelter at the same time (mainly because Watchers/basilisks.)

Speaking of Watchers they could use a rework on several points- diamond ore doesn't really make sense as a drop for them. It would be cool if they dropped a single-use Scrying Orb instead- it would help miners locate ruins and get a better idea of the lay of the land.

I imagine they're already going to get a different loot drop at one point or another. The diamonds were just the old drop when they were still big blue crystals. Some kind of scrying orb that would give an emote of looking in the direction of the nearest ruin wouldn't be too bad.

As for the ash storms, I find that there actually is a decent amount of time to stop what I'm doing, get out of aggro range of enemy mobs, and set up a shelter if I act relatively quickly. Although I will say that it's easy enough to miss the light ash layer signalling the incoming storm visually and to miss the single red notice among the many red notices in chat of the combat you may be in. I think it'd work out to have the Miners receive a PDA alert that a storm is coming, maybe even a sound byte alarm like gooncode's radioactive storms from a siren at the outpost if you wanted to add a greater sense of urgency to the storms. I dunno if that could be limited to that specific Z-level or not, but I'd imagine it could.

Another thing of note is that I don't quite see the point of the KA needing both hands to fire. You don't actually end up holding it in both hands, and it's honestly just more of a nuisance rather than it is a combat balance or anything. Instead of walking around with a KA in one hand and an ore satchel in the other, I now walk around with a KA in one hand and nothing in the other, and end up switching hands and holding the ore satchel when i need to pick up ores and put it away when I'm done and need to fire off another couple of KA shots. It really doesn't do anything other than make mining a bit more tedious, which it really doesn't need.

[Archie700]

Is it ok to fuck a shelter?

[Wyzack]

Normally yes, but unfortunately ERP has been rebanned, and this banning does carry over to inanimate objects as well. If you wish to copulate with a massive steel survival pod you will have to do so in a test server of your own. Be sure to receive its consent first to avoid committing a federal crime

[onleavedontatme]

I think RD players might riot if I killed the most reliable source of diamonds.

[Davidchan]

Or just change ash storms to not be overly common radiation storms that kill outright...

[Zilenan91]

Screw the RD players. They can walk into lava hell if they want to print infinite guns and mechs

[TechnoAlchemist]

Ash storms are supposed to be dangerous and sudden, this makes planning your explorations a necessity.

Although I think they are too short and happen too often.

[Luke Cox]

Recolor the suits, otherwise I'm happy

[onleavedontatme]

Continuing with the theme of "doing nothing useful to address structural issues or actual improvements," I decided to respond to the overwhelming NEED BETTER LOOT feedback today.

https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/16718

[TechnoAlchemist]

wisp spawn in terraria was the shit +1

[LordZalgo]

It'd be a nice little feature if you could change the GPS name of the new survival shelters. I tried and it was stuck at COM0; it'd be neat to name them so if a couple of miners needed to meet up for a tendril hunting party, they could just say the name of a designated shelter and show up there no problem.

Not that people other than me actually use the GPS. Also, there should probably be a third available there, just in case all of the miners are feeling cooperative. That or they could be added to the mining supply lockers. Then if they wanted to, they could take a spare from one of the backup lockers and leave it at a ruin to mark its location if they plan on going back later.