Cannon weapon thingy with flouro acid loaded

Ezel · Post by **Ezel** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 7:26 am #126439

So ya know that pipe you can make with 2 pipes 5 metal sheets wrench welding tool and wrapping paper?

Well we all know if you load it with shards it instakills unarmoured poeple
BUT if you load it with flouro acid it will insta kill you no matter what happens no crit or something just like a death wand affect it smelts your armor off and your shields (likely to smelt ALL YOUR STUFF THAT YER WEARING)

Its like a new syringe gun against wizards with hardsuits but this will smelt your hardsuit off and disables robe spells and instakills you
Same goes for nuke ops
Same goes for rev doesnt matter how armoured you are takes 1 rev chemist to outmatch you in weaponry

(And whos genuis idea was to putting beakers in these cannons anyways with liquid chems)

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 7:39 am #126441

I'm surprised it took someone this long to try it.

Bluespace · Post by **Bluespace** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:01 am #126446

Arrest people with pneumatic cannons.
Don't nerf it.

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:04 am #126447

So why does this even work?

Does it magically transfer all the reagents to the victim's system, or does it just like, force a touch reaction regardless of protection?

spainy · Post by **spainy** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:06 am #126448

Also fun: max potency death nettles. Insta-husk I hear.

BillWilson · Post by **BillWilson** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:08 am #126449

You can't put IEDs (or grenades) in them, they don't go off, and if you set them off then put them in, they just fall out.

Lame.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:10 am #126450

Don't nerf it. Pneumatic cannons are single-shot, and if you load it with beakers of acid then it's one shot period, and you won't be able to make enough acid to get more than one or two shots with it anyway, and anyone can tell you're making crazy amounts of acid anyway.

To be honest, I don't remember the last time I was killed by a pneumatic cannon given how easy it is to dodge.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:49 am #126454

i cant remember the last time i saw one and i play warden.

Ezel · Post by **Ezel** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:25 am #126461

lumipharon wrote:So why does this even work?

Does it magically transfer all the reagents to the victim's system, or does it just like, force a touch reaction regardless of protection?

Throwing beakers with reagents on poeple splashes the shit on them

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:09 am #126472

Ezel wrote:
lumipharon wrote:So why does this even work?

Does it magically transfer all the reagents to the victim's system, or does it just like, force a touch reaction regardless of protection?
Throwing beakers with reagents on poeple splashes the shit on them

wasn't this removed?

TheNightingale · Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:38 am

Nope. I threw a beaker of fluorosulfuric on a greytider just yesterday and their face melted off. Now imagine this with a pneumatic cannon.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:04 am #126487

Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.

callanrockslol · Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:17 am

Tornadium wrote:Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.

Literally one thread of people even know it exists.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:19 am #126492

Tornadium wrote:Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.

Its bulky, knocks yourself down, is one shot and not trivial to make for most jobs though.

Not-Dorsidarf · Sun Jul 30, 2023 1:33 am

CPTANT wrote:
Tornadium wrote:Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.
Its bulky, knocks yourself down, is one shot and not trivial to make for most jobs though.

self-knockdown is getting removed for some bumfuck reason

Xhuis · Post by **Xhuis** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:54 am #126499

Self-knockdown was never required to use the cannon. That only happened on pressure 3, which makes the projectiles travel very quickly at the cost of basically emptying the gas tank.

I can easily prohibit beakers from being stored in the cannon, but I won't for one reason: projectiles are easy to dodge, and a single missed projectile empties your entire acid supply.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:55 am #126500

CPTANT wrote:
Tornadium wrote:Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.
Its bulky, knocks yourself down, is one shot and not trivial to make for most jobs though.

It does however provide you with an instant "GG I WIN NO RE" weapon.

Not even fucking Traitors have access to that.

Raven776 · Post by **Raven776** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:09 pm #126503

A properly cooked minibomb.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 12:48 pm #126507

Raven776 wrote:A properly cooked minibomb.

Which you at least have a chance to survive or dodge.

Someone can just pull this out and kill you before you can react with 0 margin of error.

Ezel · Post by **Ezel** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 2:11 pm #126520

Tornadium wrote:
Raven776 wrote:A properly cooked minibomb.
Which you at least have a chance to survive or dodge.

Someone can just pull this out and kill you before you can react with 0 margin of error.

Aka ghetto deathwand

Incomptinence · Thu Oct 15, 2015 2:29 pm

How is using a ridiculous amount of chemicals from one of the more important jobs for a single kill ghetto?

Doesn't it have bad range too?

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:00 pm #126530

Incomptinence wrote:How is using a ridiculous amount of chemicals from one of the more important jobs for a single kill ghetto?

Doesn't it have bad range too?

You need chemicals to build the Cannon?

I didn't think it was that expensive, the chems are only used as ammunition and even loaded with glass the thing fucking kills you in one hit.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:43 pm #126537

Tornadium wrote:
CPTANT wrote:
Tornadium wrote:Can we seriously fucking nerf the Pneumatic Cannon already?

One hit kills are a fucking joke.
Its bulky, knocks yourself down, is one shot and not trivial to make for most jobs though.
It does however provide you with an instant "GG I WIN NO RE" weapon.

Not even fucking Traitors have access to that.

You realize stuns are innately 'gg I win no re', except perhaps moreso than a pneumatic cannon given that it's ridiculously obvious that they're running around with a cannon and people will avoid you or beat you to death for having it out. Even revolvers two-shot kill - the core difference between a revolver and a pneumatic cannon is that the pneumatic cannon can only be shot once and requires a crapton of prep work, while the revolver can be shot as much as you have ammunition for it. One hit with a revolver makes the second impossible to dodge, and the ebow stun is as close to gg no re as you can get since it can be chained.

It's fine. You can dodge the acid. You can dodge a cannon filled with shards. And anyway, they take a while to build, require an oxytank set to 3 to do much, in exchange for requiring a new oxytank or a refill after every use, and are tedious to refill. If you're using acid, you'd be lucky to get one or two shots out of it given how much acid you'd burn through. I've killed a crapton of people carrying pneumatic cannons. This game really shouldn't be 'HELP SOMEONE KILLED ME, NERF X' like feedback has been for the last few days, because all the nerfs in recent mind has really dampered the fun I've gotten out of this game, especially the constant chem nerfing that makes most grenades utterly worthless (you can basically choose between generic phlog/cl3 grenade... or phlog/cl3 grenades).

FYI: This isn't biased. I never use pneumatic launchers because they're not to my taste. Single shot with an incredibly slow reload is far too unreliable.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 3:50 pm #126542

Tornadium wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:How is using a ridiculous amount of chemicals from one of the more important jobs for a single kill ghetto?

Doesn't it have bad range too?
You need chemicals to build the Cannon?

I didn't think it was that expensive, the chems are only used as ammunition and even loaded with glass the thing fucking kills you in one hit.

Fairly sure it does not kill you in one hit loaded with glass flat-out, and if you're wearing armor you definitely survive the blast. You WILL bleed to death very quickly though.

Tornadium · Post by **Tornadium** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:01 pm #126559

Amelius wrote:
Tornadium wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:How is using a ridiculous amount of chemicals from one of the more important jobs for a single kill ghetto?

Doesn't it have bad range too?
You need chemicals to build the Cannon?

I didn't think it was that expensive, the chems are only used as ammunition and even loaded with glass the thing fucking kills you in one hit.
Fairly sure it does not kill you in one hit loaded with glass flat-out, and if you're wearing armor you definitely survive the blast. You WILL bleed to death very quickly though.

Got hit with a full glass cannon a day or two ago. I was up for maybe 3 seconds before bleeding into crit. This was with Armor + Helmet.

onleavedontatme · Thu Oct 15, 2015 5:39 pm

Tornadium wrote:
Not even fucking Traitors have access to that.

Revolvers? 2 shots to crit doesnt really leave time to do anything if they get the drop on you.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:01 pm #126574

Correct, even if you do react the first (Or if your HoS/Capn second shot) will fuck you up so badly that you have no chance to dodge or move away.

On the cannon I'm iffy. I'm all for lethality but on that token a one shot kill is something usually only the Wizard has.

Helios · Post by **Helios** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 6:35 pm #126582

Doesn't the same thing happen if you fill an alcohol bottle with acid, it does 15 damage then covers their body in acid?

John_Oxford · Post by **John_Oxford** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 7:44 pm #126597

"i ded plz nurf" #2

Firstly, i never tried this, thank you for the weapon idea.

Pros:
One hit Kill deathwand

Cons:
Limited Gas Supply
Bumb-Fuck obvious that your making 1000 units of acid
Big ass hand sprite
Pressure 3 knocks you down
Requires not only chemistry, but engineering parts to make
Requires you to break into chemistry, make acid, break into engineering, steal pipes, and put the weapon together without anyone going "Oh shit he's making a puematic cannon"
Requires you to break into chemistry if your a engineer, and vice versa. You can't be a chemist and a engineer.
If you miss, the reload time is ridiculious.
If you miss, you can be disarmed easily
Its easy to miss with the weapon
You can only carry so many air tanks, and so many beakers of acid.
You get fucking rekted by sec if you are searched, and found with this shit on you.

Now that being said, just because something /can/ theoretically one hit kill someone, you all are going to whine and bitch about how "urhmahgurd 1 het keel dat ar nut fairrrr, nurf plzplzplz

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:30 pm #126620

There is a difference between a stun, a 2 hit revolver CRIT and a one shot face melting KILL.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:32 pm #126622

lumipharon wrote:There is a difference between a stun, a 2 hit revolver CRIT and a one shot face melting KILL.

I can also one hit gib you just fine with a tank transfer valve bomb and thats a lot easier to setup and hide.

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 8:45 pm #126629

An assistant (or if you're specifically talking about acid, chemists and botanists) can't make bombs.

Edit: although botanists can make not terrible nades if they have way too much time

Incomptinence · Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:17 pm

A chemist or maybe scientist can make explosive grenades though. Probably a better use of their chemicals than the "OH MY GOD I CAN'T 1V1 DUALU HIM!".

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:19 pm #126648

lumipharon wrote:An assistant (or if you're specifically talking about acid, chemists and botanists) can't make bombs.

Edit: although botanists can make not terrible nades if they have way too much time

Holy shit I just checked and botany only needs to grow like 3 plants to get all the chemicals required for nitroglycerin man I'm totally doing this.

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:24 pm #126655

It's rediculously inefficient - you need so much fucking corn to make 1 nitro nade, jesus fuck.

Also chem and sci can only make at best 2,4,something, unless they have bluespace beakers. Not really comparable to a 5,10,20 toxin bomb.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 9:38 pm #126671

Actually you don't even need to break into engineering to make a pneumatic cannon, just take some random air pipes in maint out and use those, and everything else can be found in prime tool storage by deconning some tables, getting tools out of the youtool, and getting more wrapping paper out of the duplicatable wrapping paper wrappers that spawn in prime tool storage. So you can actually get these round start, and your only problem will be an oxygen tank, but all it takes is like .2 seconds to either break or decon the first window to EVA to get in there. A spear will suffice for that.

invisty · Post by **invisty** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:04 pm #126691

I feel that there ought to be some check that when a player takes damage and enters crit, that they can't go immediately to dead. Maybe cap the damage upon entering crit or something. ex_act() and other logical cases excluded, of course. Acid does not instantly kill people.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:06 pm #126693

I mean, if acid instantly melts all the flesh on your entire body except for your brain you're probablly gonna get instantly killed.

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 10:45 pm #126714

lumipharon wrote:It's rediculously inefficient - you need so much fucking corn to make 1 nitro nade, jesus fuck.

Also chem and sci can only make at best 2,4,something, unless they have bluespace beakers. Not really comparable to a 5,10,20 toxin bomb.

How much corn oil does a max potency corn cob have? It doesn't sound out of the realm of possibility to be honest.

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Oct 15, 2015 11:30 pm #126729

I can't remember, but the reactions are super inefficient.

you need 4 corn oil, 2 sacid, 1 fluroacid for 2u of nitro.

that's 400u of corn oil, 200u of sulfuric acid and 100u of fluro acid for a large beaker nitro nade.

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:39 am #126746

It's actually 3 parts corn 5 parts sulphuric acid 4 parts fluoro, which is a little more bearable. for 2 large beakers worth that's like... 80u of corn oil? Doesn't sound too outrageous.
Edit: Wait shit the glycerol reaction is fucking pants. About triple that amount of corn oil then.

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 12:58 am #126752

It's 300u of corn oil + 100u s acid for the Glycerol.
100u of glycerol, s acid and f acid for 200u of nitro.

J_Madison · Post by **J_Madison** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 1:02 am #126754

Why the fuck do assistants have access to a one hit KO weapon in the first place?

These cannons don't even make else, remove it or change it so an assistant can't one hit the captain by popping out of a locker and shooting it.

newfren · Post by **newfren** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:20 am #126773

lumipharon wrote:It's 300u of corn oil + 100u s acid for the Glycerol.
100u of glycerol, s acid and f acid for 200u of nitro.

But you cannot put more than 2 large beakers in a grenade casing, nor can you have stable nitroglycerin - it explodes immeadiately upon mixing. The best mix for a grenade would be 65 each of glycerol, sulphuric acid, and fluorosulphuric acid - that means 195 corn oil, 130 sulphuric acid, and 65 fluorosulphuric acid.

I just tested on basil how hard that would be to actually get - I managed to get 86 potency 10 yield corn, each single cob had 10 corn oil in it - that's all the corn you need from one harvest if you're moderately lucky.

Sulphuric acid you get 50u at a time from a single 100 potency nettle branch, fluorosulphuric's the same but from death nettle branches.

Testing that grenade at the toxins test site gave me a 4/9/20 strength grenade, for what amounted to maybe 10 minutes work, depending on how lucky you are mutating death nettles.

Post by **lumipharon** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 2:28 am #126778

you can actually get the full 200u because you can split quantities into more then just full numbers, but this has already gone off topic a fair bit.

Basically, filling up a weapon that any greyshirt can make given a couple of minutes and some tools, with acid that takes a minute or so + some beakers to do, with acid straight from the tap (or nettles) to 1 hit kill people is pretty awful.

Zilenan91 · Post by **Zilenan91** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:01 am #126786

Perhaps placing containers into pneumatic cannons should just make them spill out of it once put inside?

Raven776 · Post by **Raven776** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:07 am #126790

Acid in general is pretty awful.

Saegrimr · Post by **Saegrimr** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:15 am #126792

So testing this.

5 throwing stars puts you at 105 brute, no embeds.
3 e-daggers is also an instant kill, no embeds. Strangely it only holds 3 e-daggers.
3 bottles of 30u each fluoroacid will instantly crit. About 120 damage spread over fire/brute
5 bottles of 30u will strip deathsquads down to nothing, but at least it wont crit them.
10 bottles of 30u will instantly husk you. 400+ damage, could be higher because 400 is the cap here.

tuypo1 · Post by **tuypo1** » Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:23 am #126794

Steelpoint wrote:Correct, even if you do react the first (Or if your HoS/Capn second shot) will fuck you up so badly that you have no chance to dodge or move away.

On the cannon I'm iffy. I'm all for lethality but on that token a one shot kill is something usually only the Wizard has.

my thoughts are the same im leaning towards its probably fine but im not
completly sure.

I have never used one before i will have to try it myself to decide.

Super Aggro Crag · Fri Oct 16, 2015 3:32 am

honestly this sounds fun and shouldn't be nerfed because it's funny.