Coderbus Boogaloo Pt. II: Still Shitty

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:41 pm #106639

Bottom post of the previous page:

WJohnston wrote:and the PR's creator has given the go-ahead.

Funny you say that.

AdenAbrafo · Post by **AdenAbrafo** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 9:42 pm #106640

It's a mark of a fool to try to initiate change by complaining to people who can't do anything.
The headmins, admins and technical host have no authority or power over coderbus. This should be discussed in the irc or on a github page but not here.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 10:16 pm #106643

What part of Steelpoint was banned from IRC and Github for trying to discuss it do you not understand?

AdenAbrafo · Post by **AdenAbrafo** » Wed Jul 22, 2015 11:53 pm #106668

What do you think this thread is going to accomplish that previous threads and a ban appeal from github did not? The person in charge kicked him out. This is like the police arresting your friend and you running off to school to complain about it to the principal several times.

Bombadil · Post by **Bombadil** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 12:40 am #106683

AdenAbrafo wrote:It's a mark of a fool to try to initiate change by complaining to people who can't do anything.
The headmins, admins and technical host have no authority or power over coderbus. This should be discussed in the irc or on a github page but not here.

>implying

If Stonedone stopped updating the servers the coders would flip their shit

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 1:07 am #106689

AdenAbrafo wrote:What do you think this thread is going to accomplish that previous threads and a ban appeal from github did not? The person in charge kicked him out. This is like the police arresting your friend and you running off to school to complain about it to the principal several times.

No, a closer analogy would be if the local superintendent (who only 'oversees' two branches of the same school with the same principal - Sybil and Basil) were to be proven to be markedly reducing the quality of education on purpose, despite mass parental and student outcry. When a teacher who cared about the educational instituion saw this travesty he took it upon himself to propose improvements to this superintendent. Those proposed improvements were buried and not discussed at all, with little to no reason provided, and when the teacher sought an answer as to why this occurred and to discuss the proposed improvements in general, he was fired by the superintendent, despite being generally well-liked by parents and students alike, and listenedto feedback and criticism to try to improve his educational program. Now, the principal here rules the school with a laissez-faire approach, and lets the superintendent do it's thing with the education program, and lets their own administration administrate.

What this would be, is the parents (who contribute their time, and without the school would not exist) complaining to first the superintendent and the principal, trying to figure out why this travesty is occuring, complaining that it is occuring, offering solutions, and pleading with them to resolve the situation before they inevitably leave the school for greener pastures. That's all. Yes, the only people with power to resolve the situation are 1. Cheridan, by de-escalating the situation, admitting he was wrong, and suddenly deciding to listen to people (not going to happen because he's basically Paprika) 2. Coders voting him out, or 3. MSO branching the code or going back to relatively stable 2013-2014code which was most popular.

Regardless, without any of those happening, the server will slowly die, since new blood is what keeps servers afloat. Interest will wane if the game is being made to be less and less interesting and fun with every rendition, as it has been. 2015 has been the worst year thus far for new players, ostensibly because the quality of the experience has become progressively worse, and the reputation of the server has taken a major hit since 2013, our best year for new players by a long-shot (like twice or three times as many, if memory serves from that statistics thread).

Incomptinence · Thu Jul 23, 2015 2:01 am

The coders have become more adept at ousting, snuffing and crushing newer developing coders than any negative feedback by us could ever be.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 2:17 am #106695

Incomptinence wrote:The coders have become more adept at ousting, snuffing and crushing newer developing coders than any negative feedback by us could ever be.

[proof]

WJohnston · Post by **WJohnston** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:06 am #106697

Incomptinence wrote:The coders have become more adept at ousting, snuffing and crushing newer developing coders than any negative feedback by us could ever be.

Yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say that that's an outright lie? The only time any feature is actually DENIED is when there is a majority decision or a big agreed-upon "don't do this" rule hanging over a change. More likely, things get denied because they either don't meet code standards or overhaul a system in a way that is limiting, buggy, or worse than our current setup. It's VERY RARE that we get an unexplained and unjustified closing of a feature PR, and it's usually explained in much greater detail in IRC.

Actually go on coderbus and talk to the coders there. I can assure you they're actually really nice people who are willing to help you if you ask them. Yes, there's memes and dramas being thrown everywhere like everyone from this community does, that's to be expected. Yes there's a couple of bad eggs, but they're almost always completely silent. Frankly, there's way way more good than bad, and it could be a hell of a lot worse like the hellhole you're describing which simply isn't the case.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:33 am #106706

What part of "I did go onto coderbus IRC and got banned for it" don't you understand WJ?

The only explanation I got from Cheridan for my ban was that I was a disruptive influence who would not work in a team based enviroment, no other coder I've talked to (at least those with a in game coder title) can explain why I was banned, but they are quick to defend Cheridan in banning me even without a reason.

As was explained above the PR I presented was one that had near universal support but it was mainly Cheridan who opposed it and closed it within four hours of it opening, in addition to opening additional revert PR's to revert other changes I had made. Even going so far as to close a revert PR, and then open it again and getting it merged while leaving the following quote.

actually i'm reopening this solely to make steelpoint madder; merge it or don't, i don't care

Attached below is a log of when I went onto IRC, I was banned at [18:16.01]. I want you to look at that log and tell me why what I said deserved to be permanently banned from the IRC and then eventually Github. [18:13.57] is when I try and talk to Cheridan.

https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/download/file.php?id=333

Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:43 am

What exactly is the problem people have with Cheridan anyway? Differences in design beliefs? Guess what, Cheridan has almost no say in that shit. 99% of the time he just defers to what's contributed/agreed upon while offering his opinions. Which is exactly what Cheridan+HG did, Rock+HG+Cheridan did, Numbers+Muskets+NEO did, etc. It's not like Cheridan is making decrees that piss everyone off constantly.

The decision to not gives traitors more TC's was a general consensus. Don't believe me? Look at https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/9881. Notice how a lot of the "nah don't do that" opinions are contributors? And it's not like anything changed in a month, so obviously the 20->30 change was going to get rejected by the same people for the same reasons. If you don't like that, I'm not sure what to tell you, honestly. I know it's easy to blame Cheridan since he's the most obvious target, but he was just one more voice on the matter. Aran had the same opinion. Scones had the same opinion. Kor had the same opinion. Why is not one bitching at them? Why is Cheridan the bad guy for closing an obviously futile pull request?

The pull request was closed and conversation locked, sure, but that's only because there was nothing to discuss -there-. The thread on feedback was and still is open for anyone to discuss. There's no 'shutdown of discussion' because the discussion is still ongoing. It's happening now ffs, holy shit.

Scott · Post by **Scott** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 3:59 am #106709

I think the github ban was a over the top.

Konork · Post by **Konork** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:25 am #106714

MisterPerson wrote:Guess what, Cheridan has almost no say in that shit. 99% of the time he just defers to what's contributed/agreed upon while offering his opinions.

Bullshit. Multiple people told him multiple times that removing explosive implants from Nuke Ops as standard equipment was a terrible idea. They still get removed, and Cheridan adamantly refused to let them get readded for months, insisting that a revert on that wouldn't fix the original problem when there were none, only problems that arose as a result of removing them in the first place.

Xhagi · Post by **Xhagi** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 4:51 am #106717

MisterPerson wrote:I know it's easy to blame Cheridan since he's the most obvious target, but he was just one more voice on the matter. Aran had the same opinion. Scones had the same opinion. Kor had the same opinion. Why is not one bitching at them? Why is Cheridan the bad guy for closing an obviously futile pull request?

Because he's the head I figure, and the one people expect to make responsible decisions on things. Banning dissenting opinions in not what most consider responsible decision making.

It's not about the PR it would seem, but about the banning and way the coderbus is being operated. I think the topic should stay on that.

Incomptinence · Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:12 am

The pull request was only futile because of Cheridan though?

Post by **lumipharon** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 6:16 am #106725

Konork wrote:
MisterPerson wrote:Guess what, Cheridan has almost no say in that shit. 99% of the time he just defers to what's contributed/agreed upon while offering his opinions.
Bullshit. Multiple people told him multiple times that removing explosive implants from Nuke Ops as standard equipment was a terrible idea. They still get removed, and Cheridan adamantly refused to let them get readded for months, insisting that a revert on that wouldn't fix the original problem when there were none, only problems that arose as a result of removing them in the first place.

Pretty much this.

Did ANYONE other then cheri think this is a good idea? Ops are still in a worse place then pre explosive implant nerf today, and no one support the nerf before, during or after the fact.

Arete · Post by **Arete** » Thu Jul 23, 2015 5:01 pm #106846

oranges wrote:Hah, you are all cucked by the codebase

Honestly I'd be okay with this whole thing if Cheridan were to just admit that he's trolling everyone already.

Sun Jul 26, 2015 1:49 pm

I'd really rather this thread didn't devolve into shitposting of smiley faces

Oldman Robustin · Sun Jul 26, 2015 2:25 pm

WJohnston wrote:
Incomptinence wrote:The coders have become more adept at ousting, snuffing and crushing newer developing coders than any negative feedback by us could ever be.
Yeah I'm gonna go ahead and say that that's an outright lie? The only time any feature is actually DENIED is when there is a majority decision or a big agreed-upon "don't do this" rule hanging over a change. More likely, things get denied because they either don't meet code standards or overhaul a system in a way that is limiting, buggy, or worse than our current setup. It's VERY RARE that we get an unexplained and unjustified closing of a feature PR, and it's usually explained in much greater detail in IRC.

Actually go on coderbus and talk to the coders there. I can assure you they're actually really nice people who are willing to help you if you ask them. Yes, there's memes and dramas being thrown everywhere like everyone from this community does, that's to be expected. Yes there's a couple of bad eggs, but they're almost always completely silent. Frankly, there's way way more good than bad, and it could be a hell of a lot worse like the hellhole you're describing which simply isn't the case.

You realize this whole thing started with an unexplained and unjustified closing of a PR. Kinda takes the wind out of your argument. Coderbus and Cheridan didn't earn a reputation for being insanely stubborn/out of touch by accident.

Oldman Robustin · Sun Jul 26, 2015 3:46 pm

MisterPerson wrote:What exactly is the problem people have with Cheridan anyway? Differences in design beliefs? Guess what, Cheridan has almost no say in that shit. 99% of the time he just defers to what's contributed/agreed upon while offering his opinions. Which is exactly what Cheridan+HG did, Rock+HG+Cheridan did, Numbers+Muskets+NEO did, etc. It's not like Cheridan is making decrees that piss everyone off constantly.

The decision to not gives traitors more TC's was a general consensus. Don't believe me? Look at https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/9881. Notice how a lot of the "nah don't do that" opinions are contributors? And it's not like anything changed in a month, so obviously the 20->30 change was going to get rejected by the same people for the same reasons. If you don't like that, I'm not sure what to tell you, honestly. I know it's easy to blame Cheridan since he's the most obvious target, but he was just one more voice on the matter. Aran had the same opinion. Scones had the same opinion. Kor had the same opinion. Why is not one bitching at them? Why is Cheridan the bad guy for closing an obviously futile pull request?

The pull request was closed and conversation locked, sure, but that's only because there was nothing to discuss -there-. The thread on feedback was and still is open for anyone to discuss. There's no 'shutdown of discussion' because the discussion is still ongoing. It's happening now ffs, holy shit.

1) That was a different PR. The fact so many of you think 30TC and 40TC are the same damn thing is just frightening. Etc.

2) To emphasize the point about how shitty Coderbus is, let me drive this home: THE PR WAS BASED ON A FEEDBACK THREAD I HAD CREATED. THE FEEDBACK THREAD WAS SUPPORTED BY ACTUAL REAL PLAYERS WHO ACTUALLY PLAY THE GAME.

3) The thread also included a few adjustments to prevent balance issues, adjustments that surely would have been added if the PR wasn't immediately closed.

4) He acted the same way during the Nukeop Locked Hardsuit/Explosive Implant thread. Virtually everyone was against it and yet he came in and refused to revert it based on the most incoherent logic I've had the privilege to witness here.

Cheridan isn't on some non-stop shitting spree, 95% of the time he isn't offending anyone, but the 5% where he really shits the bed... it's so egregious that many people are left wondering how to get rid of him because it completely undermines any confidence we have in Coderbus/HeadCoder.

Miauw · Post by **Miauw** » Sun Jul 26, 2015 7:27 pm #107371

le coders dont play the game meme

iamgoofball · Post by **iamgoofball** » Sun Jul 26, 2015 8:10 pm #107378

so since I reverted the nuke ops not starting with explosive implants does this make me bestcoder?

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Sun Jul 26, 2015 11:13 pm #107402

I can understand coders not always being as in-touch with the playerbase, but if you intentionally go against the demands of the playerbase and ban anybody who disagrees with you from Github, you are cancer. If everything says Oldman Robustin says is at least partially true, shit needs to change.

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 12:25 am #107412

Goof ops are still sadly worse off then they were pre-nerf.

Actual explosive implants, while not lethal, would still hurt, deafen and stun any nerds around the op - people would often shout to move back from the crit op before they exploded on them.
Now, you can just swarm them and melee/loot them with no fear of getting exploded (unless they have a macrobomb, lel).

Also no drops and all that shit need to be removed from ops - they kill balance.

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:50 am #107461

Luke Cox wrote:If everything says Oldman Robustin says is at least partially true, shit needs to change.

thankfully its not

iamgoofball · Post by **iamgoofball** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:51 am #107462

lumipharon wrote:Goof ops

i can now add goof ops to the list of things I got my name put on for doing minor changes to the gamemode

Post by **oranges** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:52 am #107463

This is goof's code soundtrack

Post by **lumipharon** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:57 am #107464

iamgoofball wrote:
lumipharon wrote:Goof ops
i can now add goof ops to the list of things I got my name put on for doing minor changes to the gamemode

Wat.

Let me rephrase that.

Goof, ops are sadly in a worse state then they were pre nerf.

Oldman Robustin · Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:01 am

Cheridan wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If everything says Oldman Robustin says is at least partially true, shit needs to change.
thankfully its not

Thankfully we have your glib "I dont give a shit what the community thinks" 3-word replies for making sure we didn't take your shitposting here seriously.

Miauw wrote:le coders dont play the game meme

I wish it were just a meme. Any balance-related PR/Issue on Github will quickly demonstrate that most of the coders who do play the game don't play antagonists/sec/any role of consequence.

The fact that macrobombs were implemented with a majority of coderfriends approving it with some of the most asinine "insights" I've ever had the misfortune of witnessing just drove home the experience for me.

Some coders have plenty of experience playing, but they're still stuck under Cheridan's "understanding" of SS13 and its direction.

iamgoofball · Post by **iamgoofball** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:06 am #107469

Oldman Robustin wrote:
Cheridan wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If everything says Oldman Robustin says is at least partially true, shit needs to change.
thankfully its not
Thankfully we have your glib "I dont give a shit what the community thinks" 3-word replies for making sure we didn't take your shitposting here seriously.

Thankfully we have your essays for making sure we have our platitude meter filled from the void that dezzmont left when he disappeared.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:08 am #107470

Can we stop shitposting in a thinly veiled attempt in getting this thread locked?

I'm not one for conspiracy theories but it seems a lot of the higher up coders are just shitposting in this thread, if I did not know better I would attribute malicious attempt behind those posts.

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:27 am #107472

Oldman Shitpostin wrote:
Cheridan wrote:
Luke Cox wrote:If everything says Oldman Robustin says is at least partially true, shit needs to change.
thankfully its not
Thankfully we have your glib "I dont give a shit what the community thinks" 3-word replies for making sure we didn't take your shitposting here seriously.

You misinterpret me. I don't give a shit WHAT YOU IN PARTICULAR THINK. You are not Head Of Playerbus. You are not the community. You are a plague, a mewling saltbaby, a tryhard who pretends to be good at the game and writes 3-page essays whenever something ruins your sad facade by wrecking your shit in hopes of getting it nerfed.

Arete · Post by **Arete** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:40 am #107474

Cheridan wrote:You misinterpret me. I don't give a shit WHAT YOU IN PARTICULAR THINK. You are not Head Of Playerbus. You are not the community. You are a plague, a mewling saltbaby, a tryhard who pretends to be good at the game and writes 3-page essays whenever something ruins your sad facade by wrecking your shit in hopes of getting it nerfed.

What sources of feedback from the community do you consider valid?

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:51 am #107475

Cheridan wrote: You misinterpret me. I don't give a shit WHAT YOU IN PARTICULAR THINK. You are not Head Of Playerbus. You are not the community. You are a plague, a mewling saltbaby, a tryhard who pretends to be good at the game and writes 3-page essays whenever something ruins your sad facade by wrecking your shit in hopes of getting it nerfed.

You seem pretty adamant about blocking the TC increase that the community overwhelmingly supports

Takeguru · Post by **Takeguru** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:08 am #107478

I still don't quite get that.

It's just a variable that can be reverted in seconds if it doesn't work out right.
What's the harm in trying?

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:09 am #107479

Arete wrote: What sources of feedback from the community do you consider valid?

This a trick question or something? Any source of feedback is valid as long as it's reasonable. If someone has a point I don't care where it's from, I've gotten feedback from the forums, from singulo.io, and especially in deadchat. What isn't a valid source of feedback is someone who's completely unappeasable, and will never be satisfied whatever you do. Which Shitpostin has absolutely proven himself.

Let's look at the top 3 things people are yelling at me about:
TC Increase PR closed? https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/10765 was merged by myself, which was something that had the same goal but with actual direction instead of a hamfisted and lazy 1-var change. large font since it pertains to this thread

Steelpoint's banning? The two of us talked it over the next day and he was unbanned.

Explosive Implant Removal? There were issues, so I tried to address them here: https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/8107 , and then the fix had issues as well so I planned to readd them. Iamgoofball wanted to do his own change to explosive implants so I let him handle it. Still being harassed about this because "I took too long".

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:14 am #107480

Takeguru wrote:I still don't quite get that.

It's just a variable that can be reverted in seconds if it doesn't work out right.
What's the harm in trying?

Cheridan's ego, apparently.

Seriously, I came into this thread relatively neutral but the coderbus is doing a damn good job of validating everything Steelpoint and Oldman have been saying. They have legitimate grievances that aren't being taken seriously.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:14 am #107481

My only problem with that other TC alteration PR is that it does not actually address the core issue that traitors lack flexibility to buy actual useful items.

The items that are changed in price are all essentially gimmick or extremely situational items.

Its a nice PR but it does nothing to actually address any of the problems people are bringing up.

Arete · Post by **Arete** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:45 am #107489

Cheridan wrote:This a trick question or something? Any source of feedback is valid as long as it's reasonable. If someone has a point I don't care where it's from, I've gotten feedback from the forums, from singulo.io, and especially in deadchat. What isn't a valid source of feedback is someone who's completely unappeasable, and will never be satisfied whatever you do. Which Shitpostin has absolutely proven himself.

Okay, but it seems like you have a bad habit of tarring too many people with that "unappeasable" brush. You've got to realize that if a dozen "unappeasable" people suddenly pop up and start saying you've done something shitty, it's probably not an organized subversive conspiracy against your authority. It's a lot more likely that you've just done something shitty. Even if they don't make up a significant portion of the playerbase, they're probably saying what most players are thinking, and I think you can't blame them for thinking less of you after you take half a year to listen to them.

Not-Dorsidarf · Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:26 am

Cheridan wrote:
Arete wrote:
TC Increase PR closed? https://github.com/tgstation/-tg-station/pull/10765 was merged by myself, which was something that had the same goal but with actual direction instead of a hamfisted and lazy 1-var change. large font since it pertains to this thread

While I don't want to get involved in this clusterbuttfuck, 10765 didn't have the same goal as a TC buff. It's purpose was to encourage people to invest in the more interesting options, which were prohibitively expensive for no easily discernible reason, rather than increasing the actual combat and utility strength of traitors.

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:29 am #107498

You don't know who I'm calling unappeasable, beyond the one person I mentioned. The list currently clocks in at 7 whole people, tracked by my forum block list and they certainly didn't pop up suddenly.

@Dorsidarf: The end goal was the same regardless, to increase the power of traitors.

The difference is, yours had some actual thought behind it.

Doubing TC would have COMPLETELY FUCKED Double Agent mode, which is already a clusterfuck as an increased number of traitors all attempt to simultaneously blow up the station so the guy trying to kill them dies too.

Incomptinence · Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:47 am

It was not a one var change syndibombs were increased in price to 16 so you couldn't afford two of them under the new setting.

Two is greater than one.

Steelpoint · Post by **Steelpoint** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:57 am #107503

Also I was not doubling TC's I was only giving traitors 10 more TC's as well as working to balance certain powerful items such as bombs.

Though we will never know what additional balancing we would have done since you closed the PR well before any good in-depth discussion could occur, and then triggered the whole situation that ruined any chance of a good discussion for well over a week.

Luke Cox · Post by **Luke Cox** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:11 am #107520

Steelpoint wrote:Also I was not doubling TC's I was only giving traitors 10 more TC's as well as working to balance certain powerful items such as bombs.

Though we will never know what additional balancing we would have done since you closed the PR well before any good in-depth discussion could occur, and then triggered the whole situation that ruined any chance of a good discussion for well over a week.

See, this part is what gets me. I'd totally understand the coderbus rejecting the change after a reasonable discussion, but closing the PR before discussion can take place and banning the person who made it is fucking unacceptable on all levels.

CPTANT · Post by **CPTANT** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 11:14 am #107521

Cheridan wrote:You don't know who I'm calling unappeasable, beyond the one person I mentioned. The list currently clocks in at 7 whole people, tracked by my forum block list and they certainly didn't pop up suddenly.

@Dorsidarf: The end goal was the same regardless, to increase the power of traitors.

The difference is, yours had some actual thought behind it.

Doubing TC would have COMPLETELY FUCKED Double Agent mode, which is already a clusterfuck as an increased number of traitors all attempt to simultaneously blow up the station so the guy trying to kill them dies too.

I find the notion that there was no idea behind increasing traitor TC insulting. There were multiple threads with polls and argumentation provided why an increase in traitor TC would improve the mode.

callanrockslol · Mon Jul 27, 2015 2:12 pm

Are you people still being dumb and trying to Cheridan of all people? It doesn't matter what you do or say he isn't going to admit he might not be right.

Cheridan seriously, when you write shit like:

Cheridan wrote:You misinterpret me. I don't give a shit WHAT YOU IN PARTICULAR THINK. You are not Head Of Playerbus. You are not the community. You are a plague, a mewling saltbaby, a tryhard who pretends to be good at the game and writes 3-page essays whenever something ruins your sad facade by wrecking your shit in hopes of getting it nerfed.

It shows that you are getting pretty upset about this, you are getting upset about spacemans. You are actively insulting someone that hasn't exactly been doing anything other than give fairly detailed feedback about stuff. Considering that almost everyone that isn't in bus regularly that is posting in this thread has supported what he is saying to some degree might show that he has some feel for the game and actually have opinions on this issue more in line with the community than yours are. But instead you call him a bunch of names and attempt to dismiss him.

You are being a dick. Please get off the high horse, its dead and you are being buried with it.

NTstation2: Github takeover society soon. lol jks

Oldman Robustin · Mon Jul 27, 2015 3:26 pm

Cheridan wrote: You misinterpret me. I don't give a shit WHAT YOU IN PARTICULAR THINK. You are not Head Of Playerbus. You are not the community. You are a plague, a mewling saltbaby, a tryhard who pretends to be good at the game and writes 3-page essays whenever something ruins your sad facade by wrecking your shit in hopes of getting it nerfed.

Oh man, I'm tickled, you really don't understand how deeply you've deluded yourself. I don't use phrases like "community" unless I'm explicitly referring to an issue that has >50% support on the relevant forum thread, or I'm referring to Coderbus behavior toward these forums and the community they represent, not anyone/anything that *I* represent, since I have no goddamn illusions about my role here. You're trying really hard to build that strawman and it's not going to work.

Only iota of truth present in your comment is that I write a lot. It's fucking hilarious that you're going to fault someone for lengthy feedback when just a week ago you went on a similar rant in this very thread about how I wasn't doing enough to communicate my thoughts to coders just goes to show the extent of the deluded little narrative you've built up to justify why you're still right and everyone who criticizes you is wrong.

Cheridan wrote:What isn't a valid source of feedback is someone who's completely unappeasable, and will never be satisfied whatever you do. Which Shitpostin has absolutely proven himself.

Let's look through our comment histories and see which of us looks like they're trying to improve the game and which of us is a Platinum member of the Shitposter's Club.

It's hard to be unappeasable when you've done absolutely nothing to appease anyone here. The best evidence you can put forward is "Well when I was completely wrong about something and insulted everyone who disagreed with me, I didn't unilaterally close a PR that addressed the issue at a later point". When "not doing anything" is the best point of your defense, maybe that says something about what kind of job you're doing. You want a role model, look at Ikkarus and his Gang War thread. He consistently interacted with this forum for feedback, was extremely responsive to concerns, and even where he disagreed with someone he would explain his reasoning and be respectful about it.

It really shouldn't be a surprise that Gang War went from "worse than meteor mode" to "contender for top game mode" in a matter of weeks. That sort of behavior is what you should aspire for, and to the extent you're just not willing to engage in that kind of dialogue with the community while still retaining absolute authority over "the direction of the game" - maybe you should let someone else take the reins.

Also Re: The Traitor TC shitshow. For a bus that chants "improve not remove" like a goddamn cult, you'd think they would see the merits in letting Steelpoint tweak TC costs in the 20->30 change rather than just completely shutting it down within a few hours. The thread I created spurring the change already referenced stuff like crates/kits and other big-ticket items as needing a proportional upgrade too, there was never any doubt that the PR was going to go through a few edits to account for that stuff. But you just completely shut it down and are trying to pretend now that nobody else saw what needed to be fixed.

Amelius · Post by **Amelius** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 6:28 pm #107582

Cheridan wrote:hehehe strawman iota criticize criticize

i'm yoou

> I have no argument so I'll put out something in a mocking tone, ignoring the content of the message.

A+.

Cheridan · Post by **Cheridan** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 7:15 pm #107587

Amelius wrote:
Cheridan wrote:hehehe strawman iota criticize criticize

i'm yoou
> I have no argument so I'll put out something in a mocking tone, ignoring the content of the message.

A+.

More like any proper response I make will get Debate Clubbed to death, so I'm saving myself time while enjoying myself by baiting him into another wall of text.

Oh I missed "unilaterally" while mocking him.

fyi amelius you're one of the 7 i mentioned

Falamazeer · Post by **Falamazeer** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 8:11 pm #107597

Cheridan wrote:People who call me out on being directionless are part of a super secret list of opinion holders I exclude, so that way only feedback that agrees with my preconceived notions are valid, My approval rating is now 100%

Wow. really?

invisty · Post by **invisty** » Mon Jul 27, 2015 9:25 pm #107603

You people need a bit more tact. If your idea of getting what you want is to shout each other down with your opinions and insults and have a popularity contest to be the determining factor in resolution, the net result will be undoubtedly negative.

It doesn't matter how well thought out your viewpoint is, and there are some really good, well-thought out discussions going on here.