/tg/Station 13

I recently got off a round where I was a Laughter Demon, and to be frank it was ridiculous.

The Demon is nigh unstoppable to the extreme. He can instantly teleport away and into combat on a whim, he can drag bodies around and turn the station literally red, he can destroy anything on the map, including every chem dispenser and the entirety of RnD, thus preventing any hard counter from ever appearing. He can't be contained as he can smash down any door in short order. Not even half a dozen people with Lasers and Guns could stop me as I was free to pick and chose my victims and drag them off to die and fully heal me. He can also hear whatever anyone is saying on the radio, so I hope you don't tell anyone where you're secretly trying to make some bombs...

I think the Demon received a lot of unintentional buffs with the recent changes to whatever the code is that lets you destroy everything.

You're thoughts?

> It's "Steelpoint complains about antag balance" episode again
> About wizard rounds, no less
Really took my noggin jogging.

I think having a scary antag is a good thing.

I should mention this was a Wizard spawned Demon.

Just clean up the blood and PUT BODIES WHERE THEY BELONG

I'm okay with free, no cooldown-jaunting, or full heal when eating, but not together. Slaughter demons can only be killed by instakilling with shotguns right now, and even that is hard since demons can simply avoid shotgun wielders most of the time, sicne they're omniscient while jaunted. So either have them have a cooldown after popping out of blood, or make damage done to them actually stick by severely reducing the self heal on kill.

Mindustry wrote:Just clean up the blood and PUT BODIES WHERE THEY BELONG

Good suggestion. However this becomes very hard to pull off when the Demon can drag any corpse around and spread blood all over the station. A quick trip into maintance all but guarantees that you'll never get rid of the Demon as there's no way you can clean the blood in maintanance without the Demon spawning and killing you in in close quarters combat.

Also made ever harder when the Demon then proceeds to destroy every chem dispenser and RnD machine on station, and then hunts down the Janitor. There's no feasible way you're going to clean up the five layer thick tiles of blood with a soap bar.

Just clean the blood

You just can't do it.

At least not so early into the round when a Wizard can let loose the Demons of war unto the station.

If you try and clean all the blood you'll just get the Demon ramming his claws down you're throat and use you to spread blood all over the station.

Once the Demon gets a corpse into maintenance, which is very easy once he bashes down the door, then its good game as you'll never get rid of the Demon.

Everything being destructible was a mistake and i will bring it up every time it causes balance problems

Good thing corpses still have an infinite amount of blood guys

R-right?

>Crew not working together causes an otherwise workable problem to become impossible to deal with

Tough shit then. A demon cannot even enter science unless A)It spends a long amount of time out of blood destroying windows or B)Dumbshits don't listen to radio/Don't keep science clean.

D&B wrote:Just clean the blood

Pretty darn useless when the demon can easily make his own sea of blood by dragging things around.

Wizard is already ridiculous, and while I legitimately hate it when people say "it's already bad so who cares?", I think it applies in this situation. Wizards have an arsenal of completely ridiculous tools already, of which demons are probably not the worst. If we want to try and turn Wizard into a reasonable, balanced roundtype, it'd be worth having this discussion, otherwise it's kind of silly.

That being said, while demons are fun as hell to play, they're not very fun to play against. It'd be way cool if they had some form of darkened meson vision while bloodcrawling, where they can see the layout of the station, see blood, but no people or items, just footsteps when people move ala the Marauder's Map. That way you could fake them out by not moving, and if they see multiple footsteps they have no idea what they're jaunting into.

Destroying walls is fine, destroying machines and other stuff not fine. Really my only complaint about the demon, aside from that there is a bit of paranoia and they can be fun fight if people get their head out of their ass.

Remove demon drag. Solved.

JANIBORG HARD COUNTER

cedarbridge wrote:Remove demon drag. Solved.

but they can't eat anyone now!

oh wait

Sweaterkittens wrote:Wizard is already ridiculous, and while I legitimately hate it when people say "it's already bad so who cares?", I think it applies in this situation. Wizards have an arsenal of completely ridiculous tools already, of which demons are probably not the worst. If we want to try and turn Wizard into a reasonable, balanced roundtype, it'd be worth having this discussion, otherwise it's kind of silly.

>Reasonable and balanced
>One wizard trying to outclick 50+ people in the crew trying to outclick them

You're retarded. Any attempts to balance the wizard to be comparable to the crew would end with the wizard being ground into dust the moment one person with decent aim caught them off jaunt cooldown, which was such a problem RIGHT NOW with wizard that mulligan was added to it. Think before you post, kids.

Armhulen wrote:

cedarbridge wrote:Remove demon drag. Solved.

but they can't eat anyone now!

oh wait

Actually it could be a cool idea, just have them heal on hit when damaging humans. Also it's even more slaughter-themed since you leave the halls littered with corpses.

Have them eat random limbs/organs off a body instead of dragging people into the blood. Adds the slim chance of saving people while also the body horror of watching you friend who may or may not still be alive being literally ripped to shreds and eaten.

Also did anyone ever fix their los blood jump? was kinda ridiculous they could jump past windows and transparent barriers to blood 5 tiles away.

just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

beerobot wrote:just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

*kills the roboticist*

ExcessiveCobblestone wrote:

beerobot wrote:just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

*kills the roboticist*

*destroys the robotics fabricators*

Steelpoint wrote:

ExcessiveCobblestone wrote:

beerobot wrote:just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

*kills the roboticist*

*destroys the robotics fabricators*

*kills the unarmed janiborgs*

ExcessiveCobblestone wrote:

beerobot wrote:just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

*kills the roboticist*

OH NO THE ENEMY HAS COUNTERPLAYED ME FUCK CODERS REMOVE THIS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

*teleports behind you* NOTHIN' PERSONELLE KIIIIIIDDDD *destroys everything, just fucking breaks it all from the cloners to telecoms to your face*

ShadowDimentio wrote:

ExcessiveCobblestone wrote:

beerobot wrote:just borg the janitor and a few greyshits and slaughter demons are easily fucked

*kills the roboticist*

OH NO THE ENEMY HAS COUNTERPLAYED ME FUCK CODERS REMOVE THIS REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE

Sure, but I mean your argument is that wizards don't need to balanced because they could never 1v50+ , but Demons very rapidly make the place into a """"fair fight""""" [turning 1v50 into 1v<lowpop levels>] while wizards still get spells intended to lmao "50+" crewmembers since they are independent from each other once spawned.

If wizards are going to have setups intended to 1v50, then they don't need demons. This is like having stands, except the stand doesn't share health and can teleport anywhere on the map, make "teleporting gates" by killing someone and pulling them around, And heals whenever he kills someone while also permanently removing them for the round. The only downside is they're SUPPOSE to antagonize the wizard [which they often don't do since, well, the wizard can 1v50 unless he's wounded or they're feeling overzealous].

If wizards are going to be "balanced", then demons would be a pretty big balancing factor since they give the wizard a much fairer fight against the station.

Idk I think it's silly to say wizards aren't suppose to be balanced because they're 1v50ing but they can purchase one item that nullifies that argument while still leaving 8 points to buy 1v50 spells.