/tg/Station 13

So, in my opinion, flypeople/lizards/plasmamen are kinda just rubber forehead aliens, they're barely different from humans. Lizards are just humans who aren't considered human by the AI and draw out their Sses, flypeople are just humans just eat to vomit and draw out their ZZs, and plasmamen are just humans who have to breath from internals and light on fire without their suit. Otherwise they all function, look like, and play more or less like humans.


We should have some new races that are ACTUALLY unique and play differently to humans. I'm open to suggestions, I've seen the crab people idea floating around, and me and Cheridan came up with a few ideas as well:



Crystal race or something:
No hands.
No clothes.
No legs.
literally just a floating crystal.
It speaks telepathically, and can move stuff only using telekinesis(which it has by default). It is also space-immune and doesn't need to breath. To balance it out, it's slow and incredibly fragile - 1-2 hits with a toolbox could shatter one, killing it permanently. Making it heat-immune like slimes is also tempting but that might be OP.

High quality crystal race simulation:

Bird people(cheridan's suggestion):
Like humans, but can only pick stuff up with it's tongue.
One-'handed', obviously, and they can't talk while holding something.

Bird people simulation unavailable, have a artist's rendition of a bird-person greytider instead:

inb4 slippery slope

if we really really really really REAAAAALLY want new alien races, i say we just straight up steal from FTL. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Races/Crew_Me ... ween_Races

PKPenguin321 wrote:if we really really really really REAAAAALLY want new alien races, i say we just straight up steal from FTL. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Races/Crew_Me ... ween_Races

Sure, but they don't seem terribly exotic... I'm talking about the stuff you'd find off the Tvtropes page on Starfish Aliens

Replace the bird people with a weird mass of tentacles/worms or something so it's actually exotic and not just an animal person.

ATDoop wrote:Replace the bird people with a weird mass of tentacles/worms or something so it's actually exotic and not just an animal person.

That was Cheridan's suggestion, I felt like I should include it despite it not being particularly exotic.

ATDoop wrote:Replace the bird people with a weird mass of tentacles/worms or something so it's actually exotic and not just an animal person.

sorry halo already did aliens that are made of a colony of worms it's copyrighted

gonna have to go with harpies

And then the server was monster girls

I can tell you from a coding perspective a race that has a body structure other than "two arms, two legs, a torso, and a head" would be both difficult and hard to justify.

If you want really exotic aliens we need mumus to fit their freakish inhuman forms. Like I could suggest the prime motile inspired trunk like trilateral symmetry critter with three arms and legs but he would have nothing to wear. Or plasma filled balloon critters loosely based on say... inflatable tube men/ affront from culture novels (yeah I know they just keep afloat that way and their main body is actually gene modified to be strong as fuck)... who need to be beaten occasionally to maintain the internal pressure that keeps them inflated but regenerate brute damage while burn damage is double for them due to internal combustion and they float freely in no grav. But really we would need large ugly clothing so they aren't naked, also viva fatsprites.

Incoming wrote:I can tell you from a coding perspective a race that has a body structure other than "two arms, two legs, a torso, and a head" would be both difficult and hard to justify.

I guess the whole "aim at different body parts" aspect gets a lot more complicated when something has no body parts.

I say, start by making the existing ones more exotic.

I'd be all up for lizards that are actually more reptilian in nature and lack all the curious quirks we mammals have.
We'd just need to settle for a species of reptile. Large and intelligent suggests crocodile to me.

Have I told you about the Crab People?

Those are literally crab, though.

Incoming wrote:I can tell you from a coding perspective a race that has a body structure other than "two arms, two legs, a torso, and a head" would be both difficult and hard to justify.

Well, shouldn't there be workarounds for this? Take a tentacle monster for example. Maybe the head, arms, and legs would each just correspond to tentacles, and the torso would be the central head thing or whatever.

DemonFiren wrote:I say, start by making the existing ones more exotic.

I'd be all up for lizards that are actually more reptilian in nature and lack all the curious quirks we mammals have.
We'd just need to settle for a species of reptile. Large and intelligent suggests crocodile to me.

You and your lizards. I agree, though. Temperature should function different with lizardpeople, what with the whole cold-blooded thing going on. Turns out that cold- and warm-bloodedness is not binary but a spectrum, so maybe these lizardpeople could be not ectotherms or endotherms but mesotherms - that is, somewhere in between? Might give space heaters some reasonable use as well, because those things are almost never used.

Buggy wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:if we really really really really REAAAAALLY want new alien races, i say we just straight up steal from FTL. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Races/Crew_Me ... ween_Races

Sure, but they don't seem terribly exotic...[/url]

thats terribly subjective fam

Buggy wrote:they're barely different from humans.

Pretty much the fucking point because the players complain about them being even slightly asymmetrical in how you handle them.

Case in fucking point
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=6184

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Buggy wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:if we really really really really REAAAAALLY want new alien races, i say we just straight up steal from FTL. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Races/Crew_Me ... ween_Races

Sure, but they don't seem terribly exotic...[/url]

thats terribly subjective fam

Rock men
Crystal rock men
Bug men
Slug men
Literally cyborg men

At least the pure energy shaped like men is a little different.
And whatever the fuck the Lanius are.

oranges wrote:

Buggy wrote:they're barely different from humans.

Pretty much the fucking point because the players complain about them being even slightly asymmetrical in how you handle them.

Case in fucking point
https://tgstation13.org/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=6184

no bully

Saegrimr wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Buggy wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:if we really really really really REAAAAALLY want new alien races, i say we just straight up steal from FTL. http://ftl.wikia.com/wiki/Races/Crew_Me ... ween_Races

Sure, but they don't seem terribly exotic...[/url]

thats terribly subjective fam

Rock men
Crystal rock men
Bug men
Slug men
Literally cyborg men

At least the pure energy shaped like men is a little different.
And whatever the fuck the Lanius are.

oh okay so plasma men are okay but crystal rock men aren't????? reeeee

Well they're plasma skeletons. They're also pretty much the SS13 equivalent of the Zoltan which are "pure energy beings" and seeing as plasma is our miracle meme source of power...
Lizard men can fuck off though, right up there with slug and bug men.

Crystal men are hilarious because its literally just "rockmen the hedgehog my own original character".

Saegrimr wrote:Well they're plasma skeletons. They're also pretty much the SS13 equivalent of the Zoltan which are "pure energy beings" and seeing as plasma is our miracle meme source of power...
Lizard men can fuck off though, right up there with slug and bug men.

Crystal men are hilarious because its literally just "rockmen the hedgehog my own original character".

just like my plasmamen
this is my OC "Radium XVII" he can shoot liquid phosphorus from his eyes

Mantis are hella sweet.

Buggy wrote:[Reaching bay levels of overkill]

[youtube]2k0SmqbBIpQ[/youtube]

Seriously, even if any of this is codable, it's totally overkill. Refine lizardpeople and plasmamen and we're good to go.

Luke Cox wrote:

Buggy wrote:[Reaching bay levels of overkill]

Seriously, even if any of this is codable, it's totally overkill. Refine lizardpeople and plasmamen and we're good to go.

I dunno, I mean I still think all the races should have a massive disadvantage/disadvantages of some sort which make them inferior to humans, a-la the current races, but I just think we need shit that's actually exotic and actually plays differently.

I mean honestly half these races would probably have LESS customization than lizards/plasmamemes/regular humans, so I doubt it'd get all bay-ishly "alien the hedgehog my Original Character"

Actually i kinda like the idea of the crystal people



i even tried my hand at a sprite.

I appreciate the effort you guys are putting in this, but I really don't think that the bulk of the playerbase is going to accept this. Plasmamen alone were controversial enough. Maybe as a role in an away mission, but there's no way these will ever make it as on-station, roundstart races.

make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

Except that the game assumes humans EVERYWHERE. And humans assume humanoid shape. Hell, clothing is the biggest issue. Clothing expects you to look like a human.

i don't think crystals have a need for clothing.

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

Cheimon wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

I don't see what the big deal is... if they don't work out, they'll remain temporary. If they do, then people will be glad to have them implemented. Now that people are getting over their "Lol burn the liggers" meme Lizards are actually a nice addition. Least no one is going full bay and adding furry races willy-nilly (even if we did, at least we're not Citadel)

We won't be Citadel until we add literal pokemon or xenopeople

We aren't implementing furry races willy-nilly, but it's not for lack of suggestion. And we certainly are expanding available races: from only human, there are now five possible roundstart races. Human, lizard, fly, animoo catgirl, and plasmaman. Only one of those is an original concept.

If you don't want a "cantina station", it's not outrageous to point out that it really is a slippery slope. Races are added quickly and not often taken away. I'm not too bothered, though I do think new races should be original and have a gameplay purpose, rather than just being [earth animal]+people, like 3/4 new races so far, or different "just because". It's provably true that races can bring an awful lot of drama for very little benefit: just look at the drama surround lizards for so long, or to other servers and the flourishing of a vile tajaran-focused culture. Races don't have to be bad, but the idea that if they are they'll definitely be temporary isn't really true.

Cheimon wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

meme

that's not what a slippery slope is but nice try

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cheimon wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

meme

that's not what a slippery slope is but nice try

It entirely is, but go ahead, explain how lizards weren't the start of a slippery slope to more and more non-humans starting shifts on the station, potentially up to "crystalmen".

Cheimon wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cheimon wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Cuboos wrote:make the crystal entities anyway, have them be something an admin can spawn once in a while.

you mean like how lizards originally were?

meme

that's not what a slippery slope is but nice try

It entirely is, but go ahead, explain how lizards weren't the start of a slippery slope to more and more non-humans starting shifts on the station, potentially up to "crystalmen".

Why do lizards look like slipperly slope because they were the first race implemented with a brand new roundstart system. However, slippery slope is a fallacy because this is the same situation of adding one reagent.

"Dear god, we added the water Reagent. Now people are going to add reagents left and right!"

Edit: Lizards are not responsible, the species datums are. Even if lizards never got added to game, we would still be adding new species left and right.

kazeespada wrote:

Cheimon wrote: It entirely is, but go ahead, explain how lizards weren't the start of a slippery slope to more and more non-humans starting shifts on the station, potentially up to "crystalmen".

Why do lizards look like slipperly slope because they were the first race implemented with a brand new roundstart system. However, slippery slope is a fallacy because this is the same situation of adding one reagent.

"Dear god, we added the water Reagent. Now people are going to add reagents left and right!"

Edit: Lizards are not responsible, the species datums are. Even if lizards never got added to game, we would still be adding new species left and right.

I'm not sure that you understand what a slippery slope is. I'm just going to quote wikipedia here because it sums the concept up better than I can: the slippery slope " is a consequentialist logical device in which a party asserts that a particular result will probably (or even must inevitably) follow from a given decision or circumstance". Where a slippery slope argument can become fallacious (and it's not always that way) is when you fail to provide any rational backup for this. Equally, it doesn't imply that the end is bad.

Your example of a system to have a water reagent leading to other chemical reagents is a good example of a slippery slope. Once water reagents were added, it was almost inevitable that people tried to repurpose the system to make medicines, drinks, and toxins. (I'm not sure things worked that way, I'm just using your example).

I'm not saying there's anything inherent to lizards about this. I'm saying the introduction of a roundstart (or semi-roundstart, as in players could join and immediately get admins to change them to a lizard) race that players got used to being was a slippery slope that led to more races being created for the same purpose. It's hard to see that a system for changing races from roundstart would have existed without some sort of demand for it, which is what lizards created. By calling it a slippery slope, I'm not saying that it's a bad thing. Just that there's a positive feedback loop.

*cough*Givexenobiologytheabilitytoconvertotherpeopletodifferentspecies*cough*

Completely side-step the concerns of a non-Human dominated space station.

Cheimon wrote:

kazeespada wrote:

Cheimon wrote: It entirely is, but go ahead, explain how lizards weren't the start of a slippery slope to more and more non-humans starting shifts on the station, potentially up to "crystalmen".

Why do lizards look like slipperly slope because they were the first race implemented with a brand new roundstart system. However, slippery slope is a fallacy because this is the same situation of adding one reagent.

"Dear god, we added the water Reagent. Now people are going to add reagents left and right!"

Edit: Lizards are not responsible, the species datums are. Even if lizards never got added to game, we would still be adding new species left and right.

I'm not sure that you understand what a slippery slope is. I'm just going to quote wikipedia here because it sums the concept up better than I can: the slippery slope " is a consequentialist logical device in which a party asserts that a particular result will probably (or even must inevitably) follow from a given decision or circumstance". Where a slippery slope argument can become fallacious (and it's not always that way) is when you fail to provide any rational backup for this. Equally, it doesn't imply that the end is bad.

Your example of a system to have a water reagent leading to other chemical reagents is a good example of a slippery slope. Once water reagents were added, it was almost inevitable that people tried to repurpose the system to make medicines, drinks, and toxins. (I'm not sure things worked that way, I'm just using your example).

I'm not saying there's anything inherent to lizards about this. I'm saying the introduction of a roundstart (or semi-roundstart, as in players could join and immediately get admins to change them to a lizard) race that players got used to being was a slippery slope that led to more races being created for the same purpose. It's hard to see that a system for changing races from roundstart would have existed without some sort of demand for it, which is what lizards created. By calling it a slippery slope, I'm not saying that it's a bad thing. Just that there's a positive feedback loop.

Coders sometimes code things just to see if they can.

Anonmare wrote:*cough*Givexenobiologytheabilitytoconvertotherpeopletodifferentspecies*cough*

Completely side-step the concerns of a non-Human dominated space station.

they can?

A crystal species actually existed in the original lore - the Exolitics. They were crystal and essentially indestructible, also possessing the ability to make anything stop existing instantly. Although that's slightly too overpowered for the current game, it might be possible to make work.

Edit: Apparently exolitics are energy-based, sorry. But they might be happening anyway.

Xhuis wrote:A crystal species actually existed in the original lore - the Exolitics. They were crystal and essentially indestructible, also possessing the ability to make anything stop existing instantly. Although that's slightly too overpowered for the current game, it might be possible to make work.

Edit: Apparently exolitics are energy-based, sorry. But they might be happening anyway.

can they also teleport behind u

The unloved rock wrote:

Anonmare wrote:*cough*Givexenobiologytheabilitytoconvertotherpeopletodifferentspecies*cough*

Completely side-step the concerns of a non-Human dominated space station.

they can?

I mean, make these "exotic" races buildable in xenobiology. Plus with a little more variety or a means of stabilizing the unstable toxin to make a specific race. Make it require reagents like plant food for Podpeople, slime jelly for Jellypeople, dark matter for shadowpeople etc.

Well, the crystal species is pretty much the same as a xenobiology creature anyway, it just has telekinesis. Without that, it might as well be a talking crate if it can't use hands, wear anything, or do any kind of dexterous job.

Anonmare wrote:

The unloved rock wrote:

Anonmare wrote:*cough*Givexenobiologytheabilitytoconvertotherpeopletodifferentspecies*cough*

Completely side-step the concerns of a non-Human dominated space station.

they can?

I mean, make these "exotic" races buildable in xenobiology. Plus with a little more variety or a means of stabilizing the unstable toxin to make a specific race. Make it require reagents like plant food for Podpeople, slime jelly for Jellypeople, dark matter for shadowpeople etc.

i think this is a good alternative.