/tg/Station 13

Does anyone think it would be a good idea to remove the bombcap from chem grenades? Ok hear me out.

So the bombcap was added because people figured out the ideal way to make TTV bombs, so they could churn out six massive, station-annihilating bombs within 10 minutes of round start, and that was bad. However, making massive chem bombs requires far more work and far more time.

From round-start chemistry can make:
200U potassium-water grenades, which produces a teeny weeny (0, 2, 5) explosion, way below bombcap
200U blackpowder grenades, which produce a small (1, 4, 10) explosion, also way below bombcap

With bontany's help (corn) chemistry can make:
133U nitroglycerin grenades, which produces a (4, 10, 21) explosion, still below bombcap

With science and mining's help chemistry can make:
600U potassium-water grenades, which produce a moderate (4. 9, 10) explosion, still below bombcap
600U blackpowder grenades, which produce a (7, 15, 32) explosion, only a little bit above bombcap

And finally, with the help of science and a shitload of corn from botany, chemists can make:
400U nitroglycerin grenades, which produce a (15, 32, 65) explosion, the only explosion significantly above bombcap.

Note that nitroglycerin produces 2/3 of the units used to make it, and since it's impossible to make a grenade that heats up, you can't make 600 stabilized nitroglycerin and then detonate it in a grenade, you can't heat it up to trigger it.

Mass producing 400U nitroglycerin grenades would be extremely difficult, requiring cooperation from science, mining, AND botany. Especially botany. And those are still less destructive than bombcap-less TTV bombs. The only other grenade above bombcap, blackpowder grenades, are only a little bit above bombcap, still requires cooperation from science and mining to produce, and you'll only be able to make 6 or so before you deplete the chem dispensers.

I'm sure server performance would also become an issue, but if we're uncapping supermatter it'd probably be fine to uncap this.

Please no.

Botany's help wouldn't be required, Meta and Box station both have public gardens and if someone is intent on making a super grenade they are going to break in where ever they need. Miners getting diamonds is the only thing that would really be stopping 400u nitro grenades, as a tator-science will just make a port chem dispenser (or 3) and print out a dozen bluespace beakers if they are going to be more powerful than toxin bombs AND can fit in a box.

I remember doing this on bay with the ody's syringe gun, just scanned a beaker of corn oil and shat out enough nitroglycerine to level basically everything. Didn't even need botany's help.

If this goes through, then killing the station with a single bomb would be:

>Make a shitload of black powder pill
>Eat all of those pills
>Light yourself on fire
>Whole station is gone

I have NEVER seen anyone make a nitroglycerin or blackpowder grenade and use it in a traitorous way. The only thing that is even mildly practical are bluespace beakers with water/potassium

I do it occasionally when I roll botany traitor and don't want to run my head into a wall trying to mutate kudzu. You can get enough corn oil from 2 harvests for a max cap nade if your plant is good enough but that still takes like... a long time. We're talking like 20 minutes until the first grenade.

I honestly don't think it'd be possible to do that AND somehow wrangle the necessary bluespace beakers from science before the shuttle was called from boredom.

btw was reagent smoke ever made not shit again?

Because chemical grenades are basically also never used.

Perhaps making cable primed grenades less RNG in their detonation time would be a nice QoL change.

Max cap can already blow a hole the size of good transfer valve bomb, why do you need more?

Don't underestimate the damage even a slighty-over-cap bomb can make.
(7, 15, 32) vs (5, 10, 21) is a tremendous difference when it comes to the number of affected tiles.

I'd say bomb cap is good enough as it still completely wrecks any department it's targeted at. 15 heavy destruction radius wouldn't leave anything standing on a screen.

Actionb wrote:Don't underestimate the damage even a slighty-over-cap bomb can make.
(7, 15, 32) vs (5, 10, 21) is a tremendous difference when it comes to the number of affected tiles.

I'd say bomb cap is good enough as it still completely wrecks any department it's targeted at. 15 heavy destruction radius wouldn't leave anything standing on a screen.

Yeah a 7 radius bomb destroys roughly twice as many tiles as a 5 radius bomb

A 15 radius explosion destroys 9 times as much as a radius 5 bomb.

CPTANT wrote:

Actionb wrote:Don't underestimate the damage even a slighty-over-cap bomb can make.
(7, 15, 32) vs (5, 10, 21) is a tremendous difference when it comes to the number of affected tiles.

I'd say bomb cap is good enough as it still completely wrecks any department it's targeted at. 15 heavy destruction radius wouldn't leave anything standing on a screen.

Yeah a 7 radius bomb destroys roughly twice as many tiles as a 5 radius bomb

A 15 radius explosion destroys 9 times as much as a radius 5 bomb.

Fair enough, I should've brought that up, but 7 radius is still significantly less than a uncapped TTV bomb, which could destroy a large portion of the entire station. And you could get similar amounts of destruction from 2 potassium-water grenades, more even, since you could target 2 different important/valuable things instead of putting 1 very big hole over 1 important thing. And black powder isn't exactly the simplest chem to make.

15 radius nitro grenades are strong but it's a tradeoff for the amount of work put into it. A competent chemist could literally produce spacewalking chems, jump out of arrivals, and bomb/thermite the emitters for less work than making 400 nitro grenades. The singularity can cause far, far more destruction than a 15 radius bomb, and the tesla can kill half the station easily. Realisticly we aren't going to see 400 nitro or even black powder grenades very often, for a number of reasons, but when people DO make them they should be worth making.

killerx09 wrote:If this goes through, then killing the station with a single bomb would be:

>Make a shitload of black powder pill
>Eat all of those pills
>Light yourself on fire
>Whole station is gone

I'm pretty sure reagents don't use body temperature as container temperature while in a mob, so this wouldn't work.

Me gusta.

[quote="Buggy"

killerx09 wrote:If this goes through, then killing the station with a single bomb would be:

>Make a shitload of black powder pill
>Eat all of those pills
>Light yourself on fire
>Whole station is gone

I'm pretty sure reagents don't use body temperature as container temperature while in a mob, so this wouldn't work.[/quote]

I'm pretty sure this does work because I've seen Ergo do it before as CMO but by dragging a flaming monkey into the brig.

It works, I've done it before. It's hilarious.

lumipharon wrote:It works, I've done it before. It's hilarious.

yeah, i've been executed by sec like that before. fun stuff, especially when the resulting explosion almost killed the captain, HoP, HoS, and warden. I was laughing my ass off too

Chemists would be able to put 100 black powder tooth implants and a CLF3 tooth implant in their mouth and suddenly everything returns to dust.

yeah. that works. try it.