/tg/Station 13

hello again I'm spitballing how I'd do IPCs for tg and I wanted to get some input here on my balance ideas. yeah I'm a big ideas guy how can you tell. no I don't have maintainer approval for my thought experiment.

For those who are unaware: IPCs exist on other codebases as a "Robotic humanoid" that is basically like an android except they have skin made of paper and bones made of glass. On the plus side, they have TVs for heads and you can play them at roundstart and not have to beg robotics to augment you every round.

I'm posting this because I know as someone who plays IPC I will have inherent bias in terms of balance. I also want to avoid anything too wacky, as I would like to color in the lines code wise because I am not that good at coding.

PROs:
+Look like a skeletal cool robot with a TV head
+Limbs can be plugged back in without surgery
+Can be repaired using just cable coil and a welder
+Don't need to breathe
+Don't need to eat
+Can't be killed by Toxins
+Brain is located in the chest, so decapitation isn't lethal (but it is hilarious)
+Entirely new bodies can be made at robotics
+Has an "Easy revive" that involves using a shocking implement (stun baton/cell/defib/throw at a shocked grill) on them that causes a brain trauma / and a "Difficult revive" that requires surgery

CONs:
-EMPs are insanely dangerous (Burn damage, blows off limbs randomly, stuns, brain/organ damage)
-Very susceptible to pressure and temperature outside of the safety of the station
-Take more brute and burn damage in general
-Easy to dismember with both blunt and sharp objects
-Rads cause small EMPs on a periodic basis until it is cleared
-Can't take quirks.
-Weak to electrical shocks

MIXED:
-/+ "Coolant" for blood. Doesn't regenerate it automatically, but it can be created at a chem dispenser
-/+ Can't be changelings (Less options for the player, but IPCs would be slightly more trustworthy like this)
-/+ Immune to viruses. No bad, no beneficial either.
-/+ Alcohol is nutrition. Hope you got a good bartender.

why shouldn't they be changelings. imagine the comedy when you get mad at an ipc and punch him in the face and it goes squelch

anyways i am bored at 2 am so i will post my opinions as an ideals gal

1) these things should absolutely have to be taken to robotics to be rebooted just like any other silicon, on the spot revival is so hilariously strong its insane, especially in our post cloning era of medical where reviving people is a bit of a process a lot of the time, perhaps some sort of "emergency reboot" that can be performed ghetto style at a cost would be much better for an "on the spot" revive and match the drawbacks of something like ethereals being able to self revive (which gives you a permanent(?) brain trauma as a cost and takes a long time)

2) reattaching limbs easily kind of nullifies the idea of them being easily dismembered, it should involve some sort of short surgery using basic tools imo

3) eating power kind of cuts into the gimmick ethereals currently have, i think it would be more unique on our server for them to have some sort of combustion engine that runs off shit like welder fuel, and would also kind of both fit the overall retro-future of ss13 and show that these things are rickety pieces of shit (this also means they need oxygen to facilitate combustion, which neuters another thing thats really strong)

4) they can probably get some quirks whenever someone finishes making a quirk blacklist system

5) good luck avoiding the maintainer sniper team

Plasmapeople are already the perfect analogue for IPC's though, because they are very vunerable and manned by artificial personalities.



NyehNyehNyehNyehNyehNyehNyehNyehNyeh.

You have two options,
1. Solve the myriad of balance issues caused by IPCs by making them lame organic analogues, then get ur pr closed cause maints have already said IPCs have no justifiable design space given borgs and augs exist
2. Save yourself the effort and go wear one of those tv helmets which are already in game while using existing augmentation surgery to approximate IPC, or play on a downstream with them.

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:20 am why shouldn't they be changelings. imagine the comedy when you get mad at an ipc and punch him in the face and it goes squelch

It's just weird that something without DNA can be a changeling (and also a code nightmare because of the way posibrains are handled in interacting with carbons/the fact IPCs don't have DNA)

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:35 am 1) these things should absolutely have to be taken to robotics to be rebooted just like any other silicon, on the spot revival is so hilariously strong its insane, especially in our post cloning era of medical where reviving people is a bit of a process a lot of the time, perhaps some sort of "emergency reboot" that can be performed ghetto style at a cost would be much better for an "on the spot" revive and match the drawbacks of something like ethereals being able to self revive (which gives you a permanent(?) brain trauma as a cost and takes a long time)

Yeah, that's fair actually. Emergency reboot would be something like shorting them out with a cell to jumpstart and cause a minor trauma. Normal reboots would require actual surgery - but if I'd do that, then they would have to be a little more robust because robotics is already a very busy department

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:35 am 2) reattaching limbs easily kind of nullifies the idea of them being easily dismembered, it should involve some sort of short surgery using basic tools imo

I don't know if I'd go that far to say it nullifies it. If you set it up as a do_after it just means they're weaker in combat even if they recover faster.

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:35 am 3) eating power kind of cuts into the gimmick ethereals currently have, i think it would be more unique on our server for them to have some sort of combustion engine that runs off shit like welder fuel, and would also kind of both fit the overall retro-future of ss13 and show that these things are rickety pieces of shit (this also means they need oxygen to facilitate combustion, which neuters another thing thats really strong)

actually this just makes me think it would be funny to do the Futurama joke that just makes them run off of alcohol instead. Having them require "good atmos" in order to properly thermoregulate is probably enough even if they don't need it to be breathable.

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:35 am 4) they can probably get some quirks whenever someone finishes making a quirk blacklist system

I recall some codebase has a specific-specific quirk whitelist system but it was kind of a nightmare to look at because it was a whitelist and not a blacklist. If there was a way to do it right, it would probably be worth it to give them their own set of quirks but, eh. One to kick the can down the road for.

Lullaby wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 6:35 am 5) good luck avoiding the maintainer sniper team

FantasticFwoosh wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 1:06 pm Plasmapeople are already the perfect analogue for IPC's though, because they are very vunerable and manned by artificial personalities.

yeah but nobody plays those because they aren't cool. scooby-doo villain lookin ass

Capsandi wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 1:36 pm You have two options,
1. Solve the myriad of balance issues caused by IPCs by making them lame organic analogues, then get ur pr closed cause maints have already said IPCs have no justifiable design space given borgs and augs exist
2. Save yourself the effort and go wear one of those tv helmets which are already in game while using existing augmentation surgery to approximate IPC, or play on a downstream with them.

1. yeah I'm aware. I'm also thinking I might just go the direction of making it a weird quirk that is a full body replacement (that isn't shitty surplus but also isn't station-level augs) with a TV head.
2. funny enough I have been playing on monke because I like the codebase but the playerbase is one of the worst I've ever interacted with and I feel like that's saying something. I played some manuel again for the first time in a while last night and it was a breath of fresh air.

I've wanted to tinker with some sort of Red-Dwarf style hologram race for a while but holopad code is tetchy on a good day. Being tethered to some sort of semi-portable machine seems like it would be interesting.

actually fuck all this I'm just going to make it a body replacement quirk that also repalces the head (with the antennas and screens being external organs)

warbluke wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 4:24 pm I've wanted to tinker with some sort of Red-Dwarf style hologram race for a while but holopad code is tetchy on a good day. Being tethered to some sort of semi-portable machine seems like it would be interesting.

Id like this more if it was a bit like a BEPIS rig, so you only needed the body from the bottom down as just a extension for PAI's and AI's, project a head up through the top. Bitrunners have a bit of that tech, so it might be cool to extend to be able to avatar yourself virtually from the bitrunner room when doing a dangerous real world task like traitor work.

Sponsored by James Cameron, strapping a TTV to your bepis avatar endorsed by Michael Bay.

Ziiro wrote: ↑Fri Apr 11, 2025 5:33 pm actually fuck all this I'm just going to make it a body replacement quirk that also repalces the head (with the antennas and screens being external organs)

FYI talked it out in the code channel and this can is just kicked down the road indefinitely. There's a few species things that are currently on the board (I think) to make species less a species and more a collection of limbs and organs that could be swapped, and I think going for some sort of roundstart collection-of-cyberlimbs-and-cyberorgans person at that point might be an easier sell than trying to go against The Will Of The Maintainers to get IPCs in at the present state.