[Iansdoor] Thonk - Only human...
Posted: Wed Nov 22, 2023 6:20 am
Ban Details
BYOND account: Thonk
Character name: Kelly Harshman
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 1 day
Ban reason: "As a non-antag assistant, Round removed a non-antag viro for a level 7 virus that viro had no control over. They placed their body in a bodybag and placed out of sight, out of view of being revived. That goes against new escalation policy and is a rule 1 break."
Time ban was placed: 2023-11-22 02:21:27
Server you were playing on when banned: Sybil
Round ID in which ban was placed: 219253
Is the reason/note factually accurate and fair?: No
If no, please provide more details: I was walking around the station when I saw there was a virus going around, one with disfiguration and facial hypertrichosis so when I went to med I checked the virus to go make the cure for it, and I noticed that it was an Advanced disease with the name "Advanced broken face" and because I saw the disease's name like this I assumed it was a player made disease, especially since facial hypertrichosis viruses are usually what a shitter viro would release in an attempt to be "funny." I didn't recall level 7 viruses ever having names before, so after making the cure for myself and some other people I looked to see if the virologist was on sensors. They were in virology on sensors, and when I hacked in I saw him in his biosuit (something which indicated to me that he was trying not to be a victim of his own virus), standing by the pandemic (which I figured meant he was making more grief viruses).
So I killed him (since it seemed to me as though he was griefing and being antagonistic) and brought him to the main hall to leave them buckled to a chair. That was all that I had done to them, somebody ELSE came and did whatever iansdoor claimed I did to them.
at no point did I ever put them in a bodybag or place them out of sight of being revived, somebody else did that.
Not that it would have mattered to me if he was rr'd, since I'd thought he released a grief virus. Escalation has nothing to do with this, especially as I assumed they were acting like or were an antagonist, and thus "Act like an antag get treated like one.
Supporting logs:
scrubby is d, otherwise I'd likely be able to find whoever decided to drag them off last.
Do you disagree with the admin's interpretation of rules or policy?: Yes
Rule 1 is reserved for truly special individuals that cannot grasp playing in good faith, and I do not agree with its overly zealous usage that I see in most ban appeals nowadays.
mistaking somebody for being an antag, and somehow ending up being wrong, isn't being a dick, it's a mistake and it's something that happens in this game, mistakes happen and people make mistakes, it's called being human.
you're not always going to have perfect information in this game, which something I brought up in the ticket only to be told:
"You know assumptions are not good to make and you are free to ask admins if they did a grief virus, i'll tell you if they did and deal with that[...]"
I personally think it's a horrible precedent to set where you have to ahelp to ask if somebody is an antag or not when they are doing things that to you can seem like very real antagonistic actions to your interpretation, especially in a game about paranoia, people can lie and pretend to be innocent and do things stealthily (not every antag ever just runs around with an esword beheading people), I shouldn't have to rely on an admin telling me I have a go-ahead on dealing with someone that I assume has just done something like in this case, just because they aren't covered head-to-toe in syndicate gear.
Do you feel the ban length or decision to note was unjustifiably harsh?: Yes
the ban/note is incorrect on the fact that I never rr'd the viro, at no point did I ever hide them, bodybag or otherwise, (you could've easily figured this out by checking the fingerprints on the bodybag to see who touched it), and since I thought they released a grief virus I considered them to be an antag or at the very least a griefer doing antagonistic things, and so I treated them like one, especially since virologists are a special case, as they are easily capable of making 30 different diseases each with different cures. they don't need to inherently be a traitor to ruin a round, I have seen loads of rounds ruined by non-antag viros deciding to be "funny", and I only found out this guy was innocent AFTER I got PM'd about a half hour+ later.
BYOND account: Thonk
Character name: Kelly Harshman
Ban type: Server
Ban length: 1 day
Ban reason: "As a non-antag assistant, Round removed a non-antag viro for a level 7 virus that viro had no control over. They placed their body in a bodybag and placed out of sight, out of view of being revived. That goes against new escalation policy and is a rule 1 break."
Time ban was placed: 2023-11-22 02:21:27
Server you were playing on when banned: Sybil
Round ID in which ban was placed: 219253
Is the reason/note factually accurate and fair?: No
If no, please provide more details: I was walking around the station when I saw there was a virus going around, one with disfiguration and facial hypertrichosis so when I went to med I checked the virus to go make the cure for it, and I noticed that it was an Advanced disease with the name "Advanced broken face" and because I saw the disease's name like this I assumed it was a player made disease, especially since facial hypertrichosis viruses are usually what a shitter viro would release in an attempt to be "funny." I didn't recall level 7 viruses ever having names before, so after making the cure for myself and some other people I looked to see if the virologist was on sensors. They were in virology on sensors, and when I hacked in I saw him in his biosuit (something which indicated to me that he was trying not to be a victim of his own virus), standing by the pandemic (which I figured meant he was making more grief viruses).
So I killed him (since it seemed to me as though he was griefing and being antagonistic) and brought him to the main hall to leave them buckled to a chair. That was all that I had done to them, somebody ELSE came and did whatever iansdoor claimed I did to them.
at no point did I ever put them in a bodybag or place them out of sight of being revived, somebody else did that.
Not that it would have mattered to me if he was rr'd, since I'd thought he released a grief virus. Escalation has nothing to do with this, especially as I assumed they were acting like or were an antagonist, and thus "Act like an antag get treated like one.
Supporting logs:
scrubby is d, otherwise I'd likely be able to find whoever decided to drag them off last.
Do you disagree with the admin's interpretation of rules or policy?: Yes
Rule 1 is reserved for truly special individuals that cannot grasp playing in good faith, and I do not agree with its overly zealous usage that I see in most ban appeals nowadays.
mistaking somebody for being an antag, and somehow ending up being wrong, isn't being a dick, it's a mistake and it's something that happens in this game, mistakes happen and people make mistakes, it's called being human.
you're not always going to have perfect information in this game, which something I brought up in the ticket only to be told:
"You know assumptions are not good to make and you are free to ask admins if they did a grief virus, i'll tell you if they did and deal with that[...]"
I personally think it's a horrible precedent to set where you have to ahelp to ask if somebody is an antag or not when they are doing things that to you can seem like very real antagonistic actions to your interpretation, especially in a game about paranoia, people can lie and pretend to be innocent and do things stealthily (not every antag ever just runs around with an esword beheading people), I shouldn't have to rely on an admin telling me I have a go-ahead on dealing with someone that I assume has just done something like in this case, just because they aren't covered head-to-toe in syndicate gear.
Do you feel the ban length or decision to note was unjustifiably harsh?: Yes
the ban/note is incorrect on the fact that I never rr'd the viro, at no point did I ever hide them, bodybag or otherwise, (you could've easily figured this out by checking the fingerprints on the bodybag to see who touched it), and since I thought they released a grief virus I considered them to be an antag or at the very least a griefer doing antagonistic things, and so I treated them like one, especially since virologists are a special case, as they are easily capable of making 30 different diseases each with different cures. they don't need to inherently be a traitor to ruin a round, I have seen loads of rounds ruined by non-antag viros deciding to be "funny", and I only found out this guy was innocent AFTER I got PM'd about a half hour+ later.