/tg/Station 13

So, https://github.com/tgstation/tgstation/pull/76691 has recently hit the servers and the implications are interesting. There's usually at least one player-controlled medibot every round for instance, and maybe a MULE if you're lucky. After playing as some of the bot roster myself, I'm thinking there needs to be possible changes or clarifications both code-side and policy-side, but we're here just to mainly focus on codeside right now.

Currently, sentient bots aren't bound to anyone and don't have any sort of lawset they're forced to abide by. Likewise, they're still emaggable, though some of the bots can't use their emag powers (and some bots can't use their full regular powers) and I'm interested to see where we stand. My personal thoughts:

- Bots should abide by a custom lawset catered to the bot itself. They aren't tied to an AI by any means. They aren't responsible for human harm, but asked not to cause it.
- Once emagged, this lawset changes. Like AI emagged bots, you do not have a master. We'll expect players to not try and get themselves emagged like we do for cyborgs I reckon.
- Give emagged sentient bots their full powers. All bots are extremely easy to completely disable or even destroy, so this shouldn't pose as an issue of balance. We can nerf whatever nails stick out.
- Bots can understand but not cannot freely speak Galactic Common. Some could play pre-recorded voicelines, but they speak binary/dronespeak otherwise. This gives a barrier between carbon and bot communication, as bots should feel like third-rate citizens and even lesser than cyborgs in my opinion.
- Allow the shower bot to become sentient too. The security bots and and the shower bot are currently the odd ones out, with obvious reasons given for exclusion with the secbots, but the shower bot would be fine I reckon.
- Allow the bots to be fixed via welding. I don't think you can fix them currently, or at least some of them.

Basically, I think the bots should be like very niche cyborgs. Right now, they're ironically more human than cyborgs due to not really being bound by laws and being able to freely decide what to do for themselves and communicate, which I think feels a little lame. I think them being like lesser cyborgs would be a fine route for them to go down, but that's just my opinion. Curious to see what other people think.

Sentient bots were always an oxymoron because bots are designed to do one repetitive task automatically to some degree of reliability. The only case in which a bot should be sentient is through that random sentience event(which now does nothing interesting whatsoever 100% of the time) or adminbus. The only direction i see this going in is a big policy and code disaster wherein robotic's station upkeep distraction turns into silicon policy 2.0 and bots need to be childproofed so they dont do something stupid like validhunt.
Also medibots are still way more reliable than they were when they used chems.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=32436
I wrote more about that here but I heard that any large bot rework would have to be done alongside the conversion of all bots to basic mobs.

I’ve seen sentient mules absolutely destroy people. If anything, dont let mules be sentient and let cargo have their delivery bots.

Seemed neat in the one round I saw. At round start the mulebot wasn't able to run anyone over, but we did hack it to make it go fast. It was silly telling it where to go then the person controlling it would go drive that direction.

I get the concern about mulebots maiming people, but if a mulebot is constantly asking to be hacked (to run people over) and/or is intentionally running people down then that seems like something security, robotics, or even an admin could get involved in if it happens frequently enough.

The ability to poll ghosts to take control of bots directly seems interesting but I haven't seen it used so far.

Essentially, I'm in the "It's too early for me to form a solid opinion on it" camp.

Every single cleaning bot goes off and begs for a knife to be added. And then goes around knifing and grief deleting items (caught one when playing deleting the intellicard on the bridge). The item deletion is the bigger problem, knife cleanbots should just be auto valid

Why on earth did they allow sentient mulebots?

Yeah, there really needs to be some sort of basic ruleset like drones if we're gonna keep this.

I nearly got killed by a mulebot on the escape shuttle because it drove around running people over after the shuttle launched and knocked people to the floor.

Every single bucket bot I've seen has been asking for knives.

I am here to complain about mulebots. Every single shift they do nothing but run people over, especially in medbay.

This needs to be changed, either via laws, policy, or making it so you cant pick mulebot.

100% agree that sentient mules are ridiculous, immersion breaking (mulebot on scooter), and should not be allowed. Its ridiculous that every antag has to deal with this current mega-buffed security AND NOW 2 mulebots hounding them everywhere they go, just waiting for someone to wall shove them or etc so they can squish them

Also the knife cleanbot thing was funny like twice, I swear I will just destroy every cleanbot I see with a knife from now on

I have yet to see a sentient MULEbot do anything upon entering the shift but run up to the nearest person and beg to be hacked. I ahelped after a hacked MULEbot killed me (it wasn't discerned if it'd been manually hacked or emagged) and not even the admin really seemed to know how to rule things since they don't have the same kind of framework as cyborgs do.

It appears to be a magnet for shitters and as far as I'm concerned sentient hacked bots should be valid and decommissioned on sight until a better solution is implemented.

tbh i think they should be more like drones than borgs. dont interact unless necessary, don't talk to the crew, just put down tiles and mop up blood. that's gonna be tougher for the medibot but there's probably a way to make it work

Let anybody with bot control (like the Ai) give them orders.

Hernacious wrote: ↑Fri Jul 14, 2023 8:24 pm I have yet to see a sentient MULEbot do anything upon entering the shift but run up to the nearest person and beg to be hacked. I ahelped after a hacked MULEbot killed me (it wasn't discerned if it'd been manually hacked or emagged) and not even the admin really seemed to know how to rule things since they don't have the same kind of framework as cyborgs do.

It appears to be a magnet for shitters and as far as I'm concerned sentient hacked bots should be valid and decommissioned on sight until a better solution is implemented.

Should just be an admin issue, we shouldnt have to bar the role because people are beelining to P2W/NRP territory on a silly robot job.

The general rule should just be to do your job if you are going to take the role, using the cargo bot to play security lite is completely against the purpose ofthe role.