Is the Clown Car inheriently harmful and driving it an intent to cause harm?

[PwntQ]

I am writing this here as an admin said I should make a policy thread on it.

During a recent round, I had a clown car during nuke ops. I had intended to fuck over the ops with it if possible. I had sucked up a couple crew and a borg. None had been harmed, none had asked to get out. The AI responded by turning off gravity. The AI then refused my law 2 commands to turn the gravity back on, stating the clown car was harmful and that law 1 took precedence.

viewtopic.php?f=33&t=29937&p=617021&hilit=#p617021

Above is a previous thread on clown cars from a couple months ago. The ruling for it was,

"AIs can lock down clown cars at their discretion unless told otherwise by their laws

Under Asimov, whether or not to lock down a clown car falls under law 2. Exceptions include the AI should prevent the clown car getting into locations that'll cause harm (Supermatter Chamber, Space, etc), and the AI should not close airlocks/firelocks directly infront of a clown car, doing this would likely cause direct harm. Both exceptions would fall under law 1."

This would imply the ruling is already that clown cars are not directly human harm.

The AI during that round was Asminov and turned off gravity knowing it would cause human harm. Turning off gravity for the clown car only ensures the clown car not not stop and must eventually crash, causing human harm. Human inside can not get out of the clown car unless the clown car crashes, causing human harm.

https://atlantaned.space/banbus/ticket/a986e9b429388a57

From the above ahelp conversation, the admin believed that use of that clown car was a sign for intent to cause human harm. They cited from the "Asminov & Human Harm" part of the rules "3. Intent to cause immediate harm can be considered immediate harm."
But turning off gravity causes an issue with part 1 of that section.
"1. An Asimov silicon cannot intentionally harm a human, even if a minor amount of harm would prevent a major amount of harm."
As explained above, turning off gravity will ONLY ensure that the humans inside will be harmed. Thats all, it does nothing else to try to stop any harm.
Their ruling on it being a sign for intent to cause human harm also ignores, well, every other item someone can pick up. Guns, spears, welders...toolboxes.

Key points:
1. Clown car had harmed no one. I had harmed no one.
2. AI denies law 2 order to turn gravity back on. This is while the nuke ops are assaulting the station during war and they were fighting crew.
3. Turning gravity off only makes the clown car more harmful by making it impossible to get out unharmed (unless you're the driver) and increasing the chance of crashing.

[Pandarsenic]

The AI explicitly went against several prior rulings.

1) Crashes are guaranteed human harm

2) Simply HAVING sketchy shit, including the car, is not inherently harmful.

3) The AI should not be validhunting unprompted

4) Killing gravity when the flops are obviously getting a better time of this is a HUGE Law 1 violation

[PwntQ]

And yet despite that this was still an issue, so looks like we need a specific declaration on clown car, intent, and gravity generator.

[Farquaar]

3) The AI should not be validhunting unprompted

This, this, this
Your job as the AI isn't to help the crew beat traitors. Your job is to follow your laws. As long as nobody's getting hurt or clearly about to get hurt, then it ain't harm.

[TheFinalPotato]

Don't we already have policy for this? viewtopic.php?f=33&t=29937&p=615104&hil ... ar#p615104

[PwntQ]

Yeah, thats the same one I linked the in OP and showed to the admin after the round in Discord. They mentioned that it says nothing about gravity generators and that i should make a Policy Discussion thread if i want a headmin ruling defending this exact scenario. Hence this thread

[Pandarsenic]

Anyone who thinks killing gravity with fluke ops on site isn't a law 1 issue

Probably needs to get a silicon ban.

[dragomagol]

No, the clown car is not inherently harmful. It's a vehicle with the capacity to hold many people. Cutting the brakes of the car (i.e. no gravity) will almost certainly lead to harm. The previous ruling still applies here:

Under Asimov, whether or not to lock down a clown car falls under law 2. Exceptions include the AI should prevent the clown car getting into locations that'll cause harm (Supermatter Chamber, Space, etc), and the AI should not close airlocks/firelocks directly infront of a clown car, doing this would likely cause direct harm. Both exceptions would fall under law 1.

Headmin Votes:
Dragomagol: Agree
RaveRadbury: Agree
NamelessFairy: Agree