/tg/Station 13

A lot has happened in the last two years in the codebase to make revivals more challenging, we have had cloning removed, the changes to chem as well as the monkey-men issues. Because of this reviving people has changed a lot, two of the antags in the game still gib people. With heretics, it leaves one with a chance of revival, a complete head transplant needs to be done. While it is quite doable, it can leave people rather frustrated with the way they are revived. The original coder of Heretics has stated he is dissatisfied in hindsight with how the sacrifice.

The biggest issue with gibbing antags is definitely Xenos. While crew power has been nerfed throughout the years, Xeno strength has either stayed the same or just outright gotten stronger. The archaic code of Xenos had one become the Xeno after gibbing, because of this it removed the brain of the victim. With how easy it is to die to Xenos and be outright round removed, it can be a pretty bitter experience to be easily round removed from a thrown hugger to the face and then stunlocking. Xeno's are based on Aliens from the Hit franchise Prometheus™, it really doesn't make much sense for the chest bursters to destroy the entire body when they come out. Destroying all chest area organs as well as fucking up the chest of the victim overall what be a much better experience for the player.

Should these ways of death be changed to make a more enjoyable experience for the players? While the heretic one can be argued as being fair, I strongly believe that the xenomorph death needs to be reworked or changed as it is far too simple of a round removal as is.

I hate you for mentioning Prometheus but agree with you. People didn't explode into pieces in the hit franchise Aliens™, it'd be ridiculous if they did, and it's mechanically dated for ss13. The damage should be focused on the chest and chest organs.

If the totally noninfringed aliens had a source and that source did not include blowing up to bits, I would be fine with making it so they are not gibbed.

Any antag that you feel is hyperlethal relative to the changes to crew that make fights intentionally more drawn out is definitely up for discussion imo. I have antags turn off so my information on them is not as upfront as medical

Realistically speaking, this usually doesn't matter because you're never recovering bodies from a xeno nest and slow dragging of downed bodies means you probably can't really exfil facehugged people.

In terms of simple interaction with the medical system, it probably doesn't much matter because if you break every organ, the easiest solution is to transplant the head to a monkeyhuman anyway, which... is exactly what you have to do with a gibbed body's head.

That said, it would be reasonably cool codewise if it destroyed or launched, like... heart + stomach + lungs, while leaving the rest to decay normally?

If you wanna get real fancy, make the larva 'eat' the stomach, then start damaging lungs and heart until it explodes out, idk.

But without other xeno nerfs (hunters moving at lightspeed into tackles) this probably won't matter tooo much.

If xenos left corpses behind, it may become less acceptable to kill them with fire/explosions. A minor loss, but a noteworthy one.

Farquaar wrote:If xenos left corpses behind, it may become less acceptable to kill them with fire/explosions. A minor loss, but a noteworthy one.

Synthflesh, it still leaves them in a revivable state just... less so. At the moment Xeno gibbing will outright delete the player's brain.

Unless you have the batman levels of foresight and planning to have a syringe of your own blood on yourself for replica podding, you won't be coming back from being chestbursted.

That being said, everything said about gibbing antags can also apply to changeling succ.

Traitors, lings and heretics tend to round remove their targets or anyone who gets in there way as a matter of course. It prevents people being revived and calling you out or metaing things like rune locations or your real identity (if you are disguised).

The most common method is decapping, so the real question is, how much easier is your gibbing antag method then just chopping someones head off?

I'd say for Heretics it's negligible as long as you are only killing your target. I actually think heretic is the least offensive gibbing antag. You are rewarded for killing only your target and punished for extra casualties.

Xenos, well, gibbing is an issue for them. I like the suggestion to instead just destroy internal organs, that's pretty cool.

Changelings succ is something that takes a while to use but I'm not really sure what it's point is beyond round removing someone? It's not like it's your only method of getting identities and it's so fiddly messing with grabbing and such.

Tl,dr Heretic gib is specific and rewards only killing your target, probably fine. The rest, meh, take it or leave it

Cling SUCC is for getting power respecs and the spider spawned, nothing else.

Better solution: Delete the worst (xeno) and third worst (heretic) antags in the game and completely start over for their design. No changes to those antags will ever make them fun or fair to fight against (or as) outside of a rework that might aswell be an outright delete + replace.

the stations also have at least 2 ways of roundremoval gibbing semipublically available (Cremator and Gibber)

Not-Dorsidarf wrote:the stations also have at least 2 ways of roundremoval gibbing semipublically available (Cremator and Gibber)

Yeah but you're also generally frowned upon if you do it without a good reason, vs antags that it's their entire core thing.

public mining dock too