/tg/Station 13

A system to make people do their freakin job instead of antag rolling needed in this world where at minimum 20% of the server just wants to murderbone. One solution is to make gamemodes less murderboney. The second and more fun way of doing it is to add an Antag Queue and Points system.

Basically, do your job, get points. More points for certain jobs so that people dont just roll assistant and AFK in a corner for their spot in the sun. Doing actions related to your job also gives you points. Like for example, a medical doctor defibs a sentient person who he has not harmed more than 20 points of damage directly or indirectly and that person did not harm themselves to death.

The biggest issue is that people could do antag point farming, but that is really easy to see and admins could just take action while coders tweak the values to prevent this kind of thing.

To implement this system in a way that doesn’t create a perverse incentive structure just isn’t feasible. Let me illustrate with an example.

How do you judge whether a chef is doing his job? Is it based on the number of dishes cooked? I would imagine that a chef who takes the time to craft menus, RP with crewmembers and farm ingredients for rare, complex dishes will undoubtably receive fewer points than a chef who loads his front counter with slop. No point-based rep system can accurately capture what it means to do one’s job, much less the human creativity that makes SS13 rounds memorable.

we already tried this

Farquaar wrote:To implement this system in a way that doesn’t create a perverse incentive structure just isn’t feasible. Let me illustrate with an example.

How do you judge whether a chef is doing his job? Is it based on the number of dishes cooked? I would imagine that a chef who takes the time to craft menus, RP with crewmembers and farm ingredients for rare, complex dishes will undoubtably receive fewer points than a chef who loads his front counter with slop. No point-based rep system can accurately capture what it means to do one’s job, much less the human creativity that makes SS13 rounds memorable.

you could just make it basic, as can be, with any job related thing giving the same amount of points for each job.

OR maybe have multiple ways of going about it. but everyone has a limit of 20 points per round.

This though, might incentivize murderbone and make it more annoying to deal with. Because your chance at getting antag is lower because you died early on.

The only way you'll ever get rid of murderboning and antag-rolling behavior is via the administrative side of things, but good luck on that one because you will then enter micromanagement hell.

If you make murderboning illegal I'll quit tg

Timonk wrote:If you make murderboning illegal I'll quit tg

Do it no balls

oranges wrote:we already tried this

^
it was shit

we've also tried banning murderboning: it was shit

A suggestion for encouraging people to do their jobs and making antag rolling less frustrating.

You start with X% chance to roll antag at the start of a round.

Every round you don't roll antag you gain a small %.
If you are still connected to the game when the shuttle docks with centcom you gain another small%.
If you Escape on the shuttle alive you gain another small %.
You gain a bouns % based on how long the round lasted.
You gain a bonus % based on measurable variables relating to your job.

For example, for medical it would be perhaps % of crew who escaped alive.
For Science it would be an amalgamation of technologies, borgs alive, mechs active and maybe something relating to xenobiology.
Sec just gets a flat bonus thats higher than someone afking but lower than any other department who performs fully optimally.
Engineering gets a bonus based on power generated modifed by station integrity.
Command gets an average of all their underlings.
Captain gets an average of all commands points.

All departments are capped at a certain bonus but it IS modified by round duration.

If you roll antag your % bonus gets reset to 0.

The aim would be to encourage people to take up and DO jobs and not call the shuttle ASAP.

GuyonBroadway wrote: For example, for medical it would be perhaps % of crew who escaped alive.
For Science it would be an amalgamation of technologies, borgs alive, mechs active and maybe something relating to xenobiology.
Sec just gets a flat bonus thats higher than someone afking but lower than any other department who performs fully optimally.
Engineering gets a bonus based on power generated modifed by station integrity.
Command gets an average of all their underlings.
Captain gets an average of all commands points.

Good idea until this. This is where you start causing problems

Shadowflame909 wrote:

GuyonBroadway wrote: For example, for medical it would be perhaps % of crew who escaped alive.
For Science it would be an amalgamation of technologies, borgs alive, mechs active and maybe something relating to xenobiology.
Sec just gets a flat bonus thats higher than someone afking but lower than any other department who performs fully optimally.
Engineering gets a bonus based on power generated modifed by station integrity.
Command gets an average of all their underlings.
Captain gets an average of all commands points.

Good idea until this. This is where you start causing problems

The idea was that if the staff do well ergo the heads of staff do well egro the captain and HoP do well, hopefully the suggestion was that success flows up the chain of command.

In action, people with no call to duty will play jobs they have no reason playing for more points.

how you get Shitter staff members.

antag rolling will cease to be a thing when the non antag side of the game is fun. Right now its pretty lacking in most areas

i was expecting you to suggest something like a queue for each antag where people are sent to the back each time they roll it, and when selecting antags out of online players it picks the people closest to the front

NoxVS wrote:antag rolling will cease to be a thing when the non antag side of the game is fun. Right now its pretty lacking in most areas

>What is lavaland and gateway


Honestly, antag rolling only exists because antag is set up as a lottery. People are incentivized to go 'Ooh im currently burnt out and bored on all these jobs. but think how fun it'll be if I can be traitor" only to get assistant or a job they're burnt out on. So they start minor griefing other players, and causing escalation.

remove that lottery system, remove the grief, remove the antag rolling.