/tg/Station 13

A device located in the perma wing.

The prisoner sits in the chair, buckles themselves in and presses a button.
After a delay of about 20 seconds, complete with verbose information on how the machine is hacking open the prisoner's skull, the prisoner's brain is sucked out.
The brain is then automatically wrapped in packing wrap and tagged with their destination of robotics.
The machine dumps the package into the disposal pipe underneath it, sending the package straight to robotics, where a friendly NT roboticist will be waiting to give them a second chance at being useful to the corporation .

I approve.

Sure, why not.

Oh, and it should spam messages, like the vending machines, encouraging prisoners to recycle their tained bodies for the good of the Corp

I like sec having to escort people in cuffs to robotics and risk him getting away.

while this sounds incredibly hilarious, i agree with saegrimr.

this would be good if the chair can only be activated by the person in it though.

That would be the intention, it's just there for perma prisoners to do something other than suicide, sec rarely offers nothing because so many people act like dicks when it's offered

Malkevin wrote:That would be the intention, it's just there for perma prisoners to do something other than suicide, sec rarely offers nothing because so many people act like dicks when it's offered

Oh I see what you're getting at.

When shit sec just throw you in perma and forget about you, you can jump in the chair and get your brain delivered to robotics instead of having to pester them to escort you.
Might be cool.

I fully support this. Far too often, Security throws people into perma - They're not at fault, often, because when you've got several high-pressure situations going on at once, you can't be expected to give due process to everyone who comes in - And just sort of forgets that they're in there.

Anyways, it's a good idea. Chair should be operated by the occupant only, mind you.

Merge yesterday

Adding upgraded parts to it will gib the corpse and package deliver the meat straight to the kitchen

Does it do anything when emagged?

Maybe it corrupts the brain with a syndicate chip. Using that brain for a borg makes it a syndicate-bound borg. Proceed security accidentally feeding robotics rogue borgs.

MMMiracles wrote:Maybe it corrupts the brain with a syndicate chip. Using that brain for a borg makes it a syndicate-bound borg. Proceed security accidentally feeding robotics rogue borgs.

Let's do this!

So long as it is Asimov (SS13 wise) compliant, I am all for this! MORE BORGIES!

This solves a problem we have pop up every so often.

We WANT sec to be able to use force-borging as sentence because, gameplay wise, it's better for everyone involved vs. permabrigging or outright execution.

The problem is that to-the-letter AI's and silicons will see force-borging as human harm and interrupt the group trying to do it, turning it into a giant hassle and making stuffing someone into perma (or just waiting for the borg to leave and spacing/injecting them) a more attractive option.

Which is bad. Perma is a bad concept as a game device. Anyone you really want to get rid of forever should be borged, but our Asimov lawset makes doing that a pain in the ass. Having a function that expedites the whole process is good, because it minimizes the exposure of it and lessens the chance of an overbearing AI screwing it up.

I was just on the verge of proposing we create an exception to human harm specifically for sec borging capital criminals but this chair would achieve the same thing without having to add more goddamn rules and clauses.

anyone you want gone forever should be killed, honestly, because there comes a point where they either dont deserve -- or should not be trusted with -- being a borg.

Force borging is bad. Maybe they do not enjoy playing a borg? I know i sure as hell dont.

If its something the prisoner decides on then fine.

Seriously. You either offer them borgification and then it's voluntary or you just leave them in perma/prison transfer them. Why would you borg someone who doesn't want to be borged? It's just a waste of metal.

Just going to say again, the idea behind the chair is only the person strapped into it can choose to have their brain sucked out.
If sec wants to force borg they'd have to do it the hard way

To expand.

Its a good idea, but it should not be something just plopped inside the perma brig. There are many occasions where Security may not want someone to be borged, maybe the Roboticist is a confirmed traitor, last thing you want is to be feeding him brains to use. That's just one scenario, the point is that the chair should be in its own room.

Malkevin wrote:Just going to say again, the idea behind the chair is only the person strapped into it can choose to have their brain sucked out.
If sec wants to force borg they'd have to do it the hard way

Security should still choose the punishment and they can escort prisoner to robotics if they choose borgification and the prisoner agrees.

My previous post was mostly about Anon bringing this point that blah-blah-blah Asimov AIs don't let you borg prisoners, which is pretty much nonsense, as shown above.

An0n3 wrote:This solves a problem we have pop up every so often.

We WANT sec to be able to use force-borging as sentence because, gameplay wise, it's better for everyone involved vs. permabrigging or outright execution.

The problem is that to-the-letter AI's and silicons will see force-borging as human harm and interrupt the group trying to do it, turning it into a giant hassle and making stuffing someone into perma (or just waiting for the borg to leave and spacing/injecting them) a more attractive option.

Which is bad. Perma is a bad concept as a game device. Anyone you really want to get rid of forever should be borged, but our Asimov lawset makes doing that a pain in the ass. Having a function that expedites the whole process is good, because it minimizes the exposure of it and lessens the chance of an overbearing AI screwing it up.

I was just on the verge of proposing we create an exception to human harm specifically for sec borging capital criminals but this chair would achieve the same thing without having to add more goddamn rules and clauses.

The server rules actually are very specific in saying that borging willing people is not harm for no real IC reason. It would be very simple to change it so security can borg humans by force, it makes about as much sense as a FNR exception.

In a situation where someone OOC just wants to get out of the round since they can't be a traitor anymore it doesn't make sense to force borg them.

Otherwise it's a great punishment. It turns a lawbreaker into someone who now has to obey the whims of every random person on the station. Rather than just bludgeoning someone off the roster they get to replace it with a borg.

OOCly it keeps people playing the game, vs. going braindead in perma or just plain suiciding when they get to the brig. In a situation like a cult round where the chaplain is dead, and cant bless more water to deconvert cultists borging them is a much better alternative than just blasting them all in the skull with a baton until dead.

...unless of course the AI is going to fight you every step of the way, or it has to be voluntary, because why would they bother then? Of course they'd rather just wallow about in perma until someone starts teleporting them out. In a situation like that your best recourse is just clubbing folks to death and spacing the corpses, and that sucks.

An0n3 wrote:In a situation where someone OOC just wants to get out of the round since they can't be a traitor anymore it doesn't make sense to force borg them.

Otherwise it's a great punishment. It turns a lawbreaker into someone who now has to obey the whims of every random person on the station. Rather than just bludgeoning someone off the roster they get to replace it with a borg.

OOCly it keeps people playing the game, vs. going braindead in perma or just plain suiciding when they get to the brig. In a situation like a cult round where the chaplain is dead, and cant bless more water to deconvert cultists borging them is a much better alternative than just blasting them all in the skull with a baton until dead.

...unless of course the AI is going to fight you every step of the way, or it has to be voluntary, because why would they bother then? Of course they'd rather just wallow about in perma until someone starts teleporting them out. In a situation like that your best recourse is just clubbing folks to death and spacing the corpses, and that sucks.

You are a headmin. Can't you... I dunno... make a server policy poll to change it so prisoners can be forcibly borged? Lets be real, it makes as much sense as the willingness loophole.

There is literally no point in forced borgification. If player doesn't want to be borged, they will just ghost somewhere in the process. If they do want, it's voluntary and AI doesn't care.

Where's the problem again?

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:There is literally no point in forced borgification. If player doesn't want to be borged, they will just ghost somewhere in the process. If they do want, it's voluntary and AI doesn't care.

Where's the problem again?

Thanks for admitting you've never been present when this has actually occurred, when someone goes kicking and screaming to the roboticist and then turns around and complains that the AI should've locked robotics down while trying to stuff all of sec into the permabrig for "mudering" him.

Yeah players always ghost if they don't want this to happen to them.

"Okay we won't borg him AI he'll spend the rest of his days in perma"

[youtube]AhP_p9_qNl4[/youtube]

I like this idea. This could add some strategic play too. If you're lucky enough to have a fellow operative at robotics or with robotics access, they could cram the brain into a new body. Shoving someone who's causing trouble in perma wouldn't be 99% safe anymore, which is a good thing in my opinion.

An0n3 wrote:

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:There is literally no point in forced borgification. If player doesn't want to be borged, they will just ghost somewhere in the process. If they do want, it's voluntary and AI doesn't care.

Where's the problem again?

Thanks for admitting you've never been present when this has actually occurred, when someone goes kicking and screaming to the roboticist and then turns around and complains that the AI should've locked robotics down while trying to stuff all of sec into the permabrig for "mudering" him.

Yeah players always ghost if they don't want this to happen to them.

I might be wrong, but it seems that the implication is that the prisoner would have to volunteer for this. It would make the round more fun all around.

Because anyone who doesnt want borged will either not enter their brain for the MMI to work or ghost out of the MMI before being borged, wasting metal.

Borgs can be disassembled now, pretty sure your get all the parts back too

Steelpoint wrote:To expand.

Its a good idea, but it should not be something just plopped inside the perma brig. There are many occasions where Security may not want someone to be borged, maybe the Roboticist is a confirmed traitor, last thing you want is to be feeding him brains to use. That's just one scenario, the point is that the chair should be in its own room.

You could have a separate but connected room to the perma brig. Like a 1x2 tile room with a blastdoor shutter sectioning it off at a button press if needed (like engineering's secure storage). It would start default open (like the cell blastdoors), but could be closed if they want to stop the "brain train".

Replace the toilet in perma with this.

Its great and all but:

It would be a quick silent killing monstrosity anyone could exploit and roboticist gotta Borg
Only the occupiant being able to activate it wouldn't make sense/confuse people

Violaceus wrote:Uplink implant.

Emag.

You now can lead rogue borg army.

Well if people can emag alll the door sopen i dont see why they cant turn themselves into a rogue borg when perma'd also not everyone would want to be a rogue borg

Earthykiller127 wrote:Its great and all but:

It would be a quick silent killing monstrosity anyone could exploit and roboticist gotta Borg
Only the occupiant being able to activate it wouldn't make sense/confuse people

I am confused. You have a problem with it being a silent killing machine, but also with the fact that only the occupant can activate it? They are kinda mutually exclusive here

eh. i think it's reasonable for the AI to assume that willing prisoners can be cyborged with no issue, as normal willing people can be cyborged without issue. if they aren't willing it's a huge problem but "force-borging" is rarely nonconsensual, considering it's a huge waste of time to borg someone if they are going to suicide as soon as they become a borg.

you can add another exception for this but do AIs even prevent willing borging? i know i don't. i don't know if i've ever seen one go nuts over it.

I think our asimov policy has some subclause about self harm being the right of all sentient beings. If i recall, it was to prevent "AI OPEN UPLOAD DISNABLE TURRETS OR I SUICIDE!" from happening.

yeah, though taking hostages is completely legit. i've had people try it and it's always a really cool scenario.

This is bad. Half the risk of volunteering to be borged instead of being in perma is the chance to escape and I use it sometimes. Its a gambit but its a gambit which works magnificently with support or random stuff happening which you capitalize on.

That and robotics job is to make borgs. This also means debraining them.

I want this only if it's possibility for a tator chef to rearrange the pipes so brains go to him instead. BRAIN CAKES FOR ERRYBODY!

That could defo be possible as it would be planned to use the mail system, so a traitor chef could steal a destination tagger and retag his sort junction.
or just change the pipe layouts

if it can only be activated voluntarily,
>suspect roboticist of being antag
>brain yourself and send yourself down the chute
>acquire antagonist status from roboticist

if it can be activated by anyone,
>occupant can still activate it so the problem of people trying to get antag status persists
>reroute brain chute to space/remove robotics with bombs
>machine that kills in 20 seconds that removes any chances of cloning
>conveniently located in brig so you can kill sec even harder now