/tg/Station 13

Right now there's little to no point in targeting (anything else than groin/head in the hopes of an increased knockout chance in a melee fight).

This simple idea would help provide more dynamic fighting situations:

If you damage the target's...

• LEGS:
  * Minor damage: movement slows down noticeably.
  * Extreme damage: falls over and is stunned for the normal taser-stun-amount of time.

This would encourage people with lethal guns to neutralize their target and give them one final chance of surrender (attention attention, highly encouraged arr pee -possibilities detected!). They would be down for cuffing or for a "SURRENDER NOW!" shout, and they couldn't just get up and sanic-speed away.

• ARMS:
  * Minor damage: hit-rate with his ranged/melee-weapon suffers.
  * Extreme damage: drops weapon and can't pick anything up for some amount of time.

Another neat way to neutralize the target so they can't attack you back as efficiently anymore.


What do you guys think? More ideas are welcome... Maybe damage to head might make the target start stuttering, maybe damage to body would knock their breath out and they couldn't yell for help, etc.

Or we can just add decapitation/ bone breaking and the appropriate surgeries and call it a day.

kosmos wrote: * Minor damage: hit-rate with his ranged/melee-weapon suffers

uwot

MDs are already shit. If we just throw in baymed and everything that comes with it then suffering is inbound. Starting small like this is nice.

Head
Minor damage: loss of focus aka a more toned down version of clumsy.
Major damage: brain damage

kosmos wrote: * Minor damage: hit-rate with his ranged/melee-weapon suffers

Hit rate isn't really a thing that should ever change.

How about arm shots have a chance to disarm with each shot and a 100% damaged arm cannot be used to hold anything. Two fully broken arms would put you im crit, so you dont have to worry about being a vegetable. Leg shots should slow down. At fully broken leg should induce a short stun.

ThatSlyFox wrote:Starting small like this is nice.

This was exactly what I was aiming for, a superlight-version of baymed. ...Didn't just wanna mention it because it has been argued over and over too many times, but this could be further developed into broken bones etc.

ThatSlyFox wrote:Hit rate isn't really a thing that should ever change.

I know RNG is frowned upon, but how else do we emulate someone's arms working poorly in the game?

I do recall writing up a document where damaged limbs had a negative effect on the player and ways, improvised and proper, to fix them.

This could be a good idea, but it needs to be refined.

kosmos wrote:This would encourage people with lethal guns to neutralize their target and give them one final chance of surrender (attention attention, highly encouraged arr pee -possibilities detected!). They would be down for cuffing or for a "SURRENDER NOW!" shout, and they couldn't just get up and sanic-speed away.

Or you could just kill them. Why would you use a lethal gun if you don't intend to kill.

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:

kosmos wrote:This would encourage people with lethal guns to neutralize their target and give them one final chance of surrender (attention attention, highly encouraged arr pee -possibilities detected!). They would be down for cuffing or for a "SURRENDER NOW!" shout, and they couldn't just get up and sanic-speed away.

Or you could just kill them. Why would you use a lethal gun if you don't intend to kill.

For the same reason police do.

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:

kosmos wrote:This would encourage people with lethal guns to neutralize their target and give them one final chance of surrender (attention attention, highly encouraged arr pee -possibilities detected!). They would be down for cuffing or for a "SURRENDER NOW!" shout, and they couldn't just get up and sanic-speed away.

Or you could just kill them. Why would you use a lethal gun if you don't intend to kill.

1. Lack of a stun weapon - revs and traitors especially.
2. Lasers go through glass.
3. Hulk.
4. Intimidation.
5. Out of ammo/charge
6. Maybe you intended to kill them at first, but their crippled condition makes that unnecessary.

Saintish wrote:1. Lack of a stun weapon - revs and traitors especially.

Simply useless. There might be a super special case where you run out of ALL stun weaponry as security and still keep going, but in that case you are probably fine with putting whoever it is you are shooting into critical or just killing them.

Saintish wrote:2. Lasers go through glass.

You want to use lethal weapons instead of tasers because there's a piece of glass in the way? I would classify that as really quite shitcurity, unless lethal weapons would be allowed otherwise, in which case put them into crit.

Saintish wrote:3. Hulk.

Hulk what? Hulks are immune to stuns and drop down anyway when shot enough times.

Saintish wrote:4. Intimidation.

Huh?

Saintish wrote:5. Out of ammo/charge

See above.

Saintish wrote:6. Maybe you intended to kill them at first, but their crippled condition makes that unnecessary.

Why?

Finally, you talk about limb damage, but if you do the same amount of damage to the head/chest, nothing happens? Makes no sense.

So, I dunno. It's like what, for a super niche case when you are a security officer and cannot use stun weapons for some reason? Kinda niche, don't you think?

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:

Saintish wrote:1. Lack of a stun weapon - revs and traitors especially.

Simply useless. There might be a super special case where you run out of ALL stun weaponry as security and still keep going, but in that case you are probably fine with putting whoever it is you are shooting into critical or just killing them.

He might have talked about antags who don't have stun weapons available, but attack with basic melee weapons or unarmed.

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:Finally, you talk about limb damage, but if you do the same amount of damage to the head/chest, nothing happens? Makes no sense.

So, I dunno. It's like what, for a super niche case when you are a security officer and cannot use stun weapons for some reason? Kinda niche, don't you think?

I talked about you possible further ideas of head damage equaling stuttering, brain damage and torso damage affecting breathing, speaking etc.

And yeah, it wouldn't be a big thing, a huge overhaul of the combat system, but a small step towards more different fighting situations than target-wherever & shoot at the guy until he drops.

Port dismemberment from NT.

That shit was genuinely hilarious and terrifying.

Lose an arm? Can't hold shit with that hand.
Lose a leg? Go slower. Lose both? Better hope someone drags your crippled ass to robotics for augmentation.

I'll never forget that round where I walked into escape, and found like half a dozen severed torso's lying around, and just limbs fucking everywhere. Jesus christ how horrifying.

lumipharon wrote:Port dismemberment from NT.

That shit was genuinely hilarious and terrifying.

Lose an arm? Can't hold shit with that hand.
Lose a leg? Go slower. Lose both? Better hope someone drags your crippled ass to robotics for augmentation.

I'll never forget that round where I walked into escape, and found like half a dozen severed torso's lying around, and just limbs fucking everywhere. Jesus christ how horrifying.

shush it's already planned for after the feature freeze ends! (4th december)

(I've already ported about 80% of my work over to main /tg/, just got some stuff to tweak )

Based Remie.

Praise Remie. Giver of fun.

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:

Saintish wrote:1. Lack of a stun weapon - revs and traitors especially.

Simply useless. There might be a super special case where you run out of ALL stun weaponry as security and still keep going, but in that case you are probably fine with putting whoever it is you are shooting into critical or just killing them.

Saintish wrote:2. Lasers go through glass.

You want to use lethal weapons instead of tasers because there's a piece of glass in the way? I would classify that as really quite shitcurity, unless lethal weapons would be allowed otherwise, in which case put them into crit.

Your original question was "why would you do this instead of stunning." I don't remember the binary being "stun with a taser" and "murder them completely" being the only two possible options. I'm not really interested in getting into the bullshit that sec should just throw up their hands at a window either. Both of these are valid reasons to want or to use a laser over a taser/other electrode weapon.

Your question about why somebody would want a lethal weapon against a hulk is confusing. How else do you expect a hulk to take damage and fall down if you don't use a weapon that causes damage?

Stun or put into crit are the only options, really. I guess there's stamina damage, but who the hell uses disablers anyway.

cedarbridge wrote:I'm not really interested in getting into the bullshit that sec should just throw up their hands at a window either.

I am. You're using lasers against petty criminals because AI's taking too long to open the airlock for you?

Like, shooting people in the legs shouldn't be a substitute for stuns.

cedarbridge wrote:Your question about why somebody would want a lethal weapon against a hulk is confusing. How else do you expect a hulk to take damage and fall down if you don't use a weapon that causes damage?

If anything is confusing here, it's this. When did I ever dispute using lethals against hulks?

So, okay, you get to stun people with 4 laser shots instead of five every once in a while, in some extremely niche situations.

Be my guest, I guess. Just don't really see much of a point. I doubt it will change combat much. Being slowed down at low health in an of itself is a lot worse.

Remie Richards wrote:

lumipharon wrote:Port dismemberment from NT.

That shit was genuinely hilarious and terrifying.

Lose an arm? Can't hold shit with that hand.
Lose a leg? Go slower. Lose both? Better hope someone drags your crippled ass to robotics for augmentation.

I'll never forget that round where I walked into escape, and found like half a dozen severed torso's lying around, and just limbs fucking everywhere. Jesus christ how horrifying.

shush it's already planned for after the feature freeze ends! (4th december)

(I've already ported about 80% of my work over to main /tg/, just got some stuff to tweak )

Oh stop it you. You will give coders a good reputation.

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:So, I dunno. It's like what, for a super niche case when you are a security officer and cannot use stun weapons for some reason? Kinda niche, don't you think?

I was talking about antags and people fighting for their lives.

Also, this is a way for, say, revs to down someone without critting them when a headrev isn't around. Really, this might help keep more people in the round.

Saintish wrote:

Lo6a4evskiy wrote:So, I dunno. It's like what, for a super niche case when you are a security officer and cannot use stun weapons for some reason? Kinda niche, don't you think?

I was talking about antags and people fighting for their lives.

Also, this is a way for, say, revs to down someone without critting them when a headrev isn't around. Really, this might help keep more people in the round.

This. The only way to reliably incapacitate someone right now if you don't have a stun weapon is by knocking them into crit. Allowing incapacitation via crippling limbs would give more incentive to keep people alive.

Sure, it's not like antagonists want their victim to shut up more than anything except may be dying.

Sure, its not like people might want to roll with a potential scenario and try to RP.

Giving people some sort of middle ground for detaining between taser or just beating them into critical allows for more player interaction that doesn't involve flat out killing them.

Also, it would let beartraps cause damage to the limbs so you keep limping even after you take them off.