/tg/Station 13

One man in security versing a entire cult is a majority of the time a one sided affair. No security is essentially a cult win with no counterplay. There's no way to get reinforcements and you are out of luck as you have to fight an entire cult by yourself by the time you discover it 25 minutes into the round when the AI is subverted and you were busy arresting greytiders killing each other, lord help you if you're a security officer with no access.

It just turns the round into a unfun, unfair, affair. For security it feels like a personal hell, for the crew it feels unfair and for the cult it just gets boring.

My suggestion is that if there is less than three, or so, security personnel (HoS, Warden, Detective, Sec Officer) than a cult round (Clock and Blood) will not occur, however the round start type will still display those rounds as possibilities to avoid meta to an extent.

Without security in a cult round, there's no real counterplay. It becomes a 30 minute match of watching the cultists kill anyone they see and win.

Losing is part of the game.

Losing is part of the game.

But having a entire game mode and thirty+ minutes of your time go to group antagonist that cannot be defeated is bad gameplay.

Personally I feel one of the biggest problems is the lack of incentive for the crew to fight the cult.


Why fight the cult when you can get "accidentally" converted and get to be an antag?

Biggest issue with fighting the cult with no security is organizing yourselves, the very nature of the cult makes it that unless you have chapel, security and cargo access you can't really tell a cultist apart from a non-cultist.

There are a lot of hurdles you need to pass to start setting up to fight a cult. Security and the Captain start in a good position as they have not only the innate trust that they are all not cultists, but they have the tools, or access to get the tools, to start fighting the cult.

The regular crew are all over the place, they lack the trust, and they lack the effective tools and higher coordination. They can organise themselves but its a much taller order to accomplish with many things needing to turn our right.

CPTANT wrote:Losing is part of the game.

>Its the "lol just play the shitty game mode, die, and dont enjoy it you pussy" argument again

I would rather Sec be prioritized roles like heads are, where if your prefs are set to at least "Low" you have a strong chance of being Sec if there are not enough players. I absolutely do not want to lose out on cult rolls because of insufficient Sec. I would rather we have Steelpoint's Robustin's reinforcement Security thing revived, even if the thing is on requests consoles instead of communications consoles. Even scale back the starting cultist counts similar to Rev, but absolutely do not deny us round types!

Is there a way to make Security more attractive to play without buffing them in combat, or nerfing antags to create the same effect, while also not denying us game-modes?

Its Robustin's idea for the security reinforcements, it only got closed because no one merged it after a few days of inactivity, so anyone can still merge it.

In terms of making security more attractive to play, that's a issue we've been trying to resolve for a long time and there's no clear answer.

Could just give one antag token to a player who plays a lot of security rounds to let them have a increased chance of antag status, but that's not only a old idea, but likely a bad one.

Gun Hog wrote: Is there a way to make Security more attractive to play without buffing them in combat, or nerfing antags to create the same effect, while also not denying us game-modes?

There are currently 4 roundtypes in the game where security is forced to act like Hitler assholes just to not forfeit their round. They don't know they're coming and if they don't find out fast then it's a loss for them with little they can do about it.

Why should I roll the dice and go sec when the odds are stacked heavily that I'll just get stunned and murdered in maintenance​ or lynched 30 minutes in when the entire crew is cult/rev/gang/clock?

What if I win :^)

Wyzack wrote:

CPTANT wrote:Losing is part of the game.

>Its the "lol just play the shitty game mode, die, and dont enjoy it you pussy" argument again

change the channel this one is old and a shit episode

I think this is worth trying - (to me) it feels like most rounds where there's few people in sec and it rolls cult/etc. are jsut so completely worthless and unfun for anyone who doesn't get converted that this is worth a shot

Isn't that the problem with cult rounds, that they either wreck everything because there's no opposition, or get steamrolled early and lose? In fact, that's the problem with all team modes, because traitor is the only good mode.

Fight the cult yourself. Be the hero.

ShadowDimentio wrote:Fight the cult yourself. Be the hero.

Of course, why hadn't anyone thought of this before? Truly genius

ShadowDimentio wrote:Fight the cult yourself. Be the hero.

Welp, time to close this thread, genius absolute solution.

ShadowDimentio wrote:Fight the cult yourself. Be the hero.

once again shadowdimentio doesn't get what the problem is.

No/minimal sec vs cult remains a literal form of physical cancer, I would honestly be fine with removing clockcult to at least lessen the horror of this issue.

Silly thread. I would much rather fight most conversion antags than any traitor/ling round as "Solosec".

Against conversion antags you can flex your robustness. Put the armory in your bag like the end of Hot Fuzz and go postal on the station.

Lowpop traitor? "Lel I ebowed you in a 1x1 corridor of maint while I had thermals on, GG faget"

Other *robust security can testify that cultists/revs/clockies can effectively be fought even when you're badly outnumbered. Hell I'd rather be lowpop sec than "Sec is full of retarded mouthbreathers and so within 10 minutes the enemy has multiple tasers and sec ID's because of people who couldn't robust their way out of a paper bag signing up for security.

Oldman Robustin wrote: I would much rather fight most conversion antags than any traitor/ling round as "Solosec". Against conversion antags you can flex your robustness. Put the armory in your bag like the end of Hot Fuzz and go postal on the station.y.

That's because you're one of those fucking wierdos who play this game for combat.

Oldman Robustin wrote:Against conversion antags you can flex your robustness. Put the armory in your bag like the end of Hot Fuzz and go postal on the station.

okay but you're like in the massive minority here

most of us don't find cult vs no sec to be fun

Oldman Robustin wrote:Silly thread. I would much rather fight most conversion antags than any traitor/ling round as "Solosec".

Against conversion antags you can flex your robustness. Put the armory in your bag like the end of Hot Fuzz and go postal on the station.

Lowpop traitor? "Lel I ebowed you in a 1x1 corridor of maint while I had thermals on, GG faget"

Other *robust security can testify that cultists/revs/clockies can effectively be fought even when you're badly outnumbered. Hell I'd rather be lowpop sec than "Sec is full of retarded mouthbreathers and so within 10 minutes the enemy has multiple tasers and sec ID's because of people who couldn't robust their way out of a paper bag signing up for security.

Stop posting and quit the server you incredibly stupid tedious little faggot

kevinz000 wrote:

ShadowDimentio wrote:Fight the cult yourself. Be the hero.

once again shadowdimentio doesn't get what the problem is.

Oh I know what the problem is, the problem is that antags are hilariously powerful compared to regular crew, and sec are the only ones able to compete with them on the same level, and without enough sec the crew will almost certainly get dunked.

The solution is to fight the cult yourself. You'll probably lose eventually, but before that you'll take several cultists with you and have fun. Some of my best rounds have been me playing mime or clown and beating some absurdly powerful antags by simply outplaying them.

So yeah, just be the hero. You might not win but you'll have great fun.

Oldman Robustin wrote:Silly thread. I would much rather fight most conversion antags than any traitor/ling round as "Solosec".

Against conversion antags you can flex your robustness. Put the armory in your bag like the end of Hot Fuzz and go postal on the station.

Lowpop traitor? "Lel I ebowed you in a 1x1 corridor of maint while I had thermals on, GG faget"

Other *robust security can testify that cultists/revs/clockies can effectively be fought even when you're badly outnumbered. Hell I'd rather be lowpop sec than "Sec is full of retarded mouthbreathers and so within 10 minutes the enemy has multiple tasers and sec ID's because of people who couldn't robust their way out of a paper bag signing up for security.

Beating half the server is not difficult but still, it remains that without any conflicting force to oppose the cult in a widespread fashion in is dull and boring. It becomes a waiting game rather than a paranoia laddled anxiety attack of "will sec save me, kill me, or will the cult do it first?"

I agree that not having sec makes ANY round a very one-sided fare, but that's just life sometimes and limiting the round variety to how many people want to subject themselves to sec is a terrible idea, especially when sec populations are usually sparse at best and number of heads does not a robust sec department make. After all, it's not like traitor rounds are any more fun or less unfair with no sec than cult or any other round.

So, the only solution is to fight the antags yourself, have fun, and be a hero.

itt shadowdimentio promotes validhunting to a higher degree than what we already have.

False, it's the exact degree we already have.

Also congratulations your arguments have successfully degenerated so far that you now equate fighting antags (when no sec are around) with validhunting.

imo, sec's sway on the round (especially if its just three officers) is overestimated