/tg/Station 13

Bottom post of the previous page:

Eaglendia wrote:

John_Oxford wrote:Or you know, peace keeper from the hunger games merged to look like chappie?

Energy Bola Launcher to fuck over rioters
Tear Gas disperser to fuck over large crowds of rioters
Flood Light to blind the fuck out of rioters
Power Stomp to trip and disorient all the rioters
Energy Shield to protect security pushing up
Handcuff Dispenser (can't actually handcuff anyone, just shits out handcuffs)
Submission Alarm (HONKizer essentially, blares "LAY DOWN YOUR WEAPONS" and things along those lines and causes people to drop their items and go deaf)

I kind of like this but it's probably a little powerful. Might try to code one with an energy bola launcher, a flash, a riot shield, handcuff dispenser, and secHUD as default modules, and the old cyborg taser (or perhaps a hybrid taser) when hacked.

Submission alarm and power stomp seem a little too strong/snowflakey, and tear gas is pretty much useless. Meanwhile, I'm not fond of the ideas with sedative injectors due to Goofchem overdose and addiction symptoms being the worst kind of very easy accidental round-ruiners.

You should make some side sprites for this, though it doesn't particularly fit with the station's other borg designs. Do you think this should be available as a roundstart choice, or something that can be unlocked in Robotics through R&D?

Likely something that can be researched through RnD as a mech that you could only place a MMI in.

Was looking for something that wasen't raw "I AM TIDE OF RED, YOU ARE ARREST NOW FOR BREAKING SHIT" but more of a "QUIT BREAKING SHIT BEFORE I PACIFY THE FUCK OUT OF YOU" kind of deal.

Power Stomp, Submission Alarm, and Tear Gas are all place holders for a flashbang launcher, which would be over powered to have on a cyborg/mech eqse hybrid thing. So i split the difference and made 3 things that each did the function of the flash bang (Power Stomp knocks you on the floor, Submission Alarm disorients you and causes you to drop your shit, tear gas causes a blinding affect, since you can't see through smoke and doubles as a cough/cry sort of thing)

It was going off the idea of a peacekeeper from the hunger games and chappie from the movie. A sleek white powerful machine that doesn't outright kill you, but causes you ridiculious discomfort/stuns/burns/pain

Gonna remake the sprite:

Don't wanna make it too scary looking or bed wetting babies will declare it invincible.

Incomptinence wrote:"Don't wanna make it too scary looking or bed wetting babies will declare it invincible,"

whined the silicon-baby.

If I played them a lot sure that would make sense.

Drynwyn wrote:I've assessed my ability to code this and found that I can definitely do the bola launcher, the injector (which will use crytobiolin aka the chemical whose ONLY PURPOSE is to make you dizzy and move weirdly), and the flash. The energy shield I won't do, but instead I'll give it a safety holotape dispenser if someone makes an appropriate sprite for HARM AHEAD holotape.

The literal harmyeller is something I can definitely accomplish, though I'm not sure about making it fit coding standards. I could just make it different enough from the changeling shriek that I don't have to mess with procs.

Thanks for tackling this, and for putting up with my code begging. It's encouraging to know that a lot of this is doable.

I've heard a teargas launcher mentioned a few times. Unfortunately, that goes against the no-stun rule. Daniel's sprites are absolutely perfect, so I think we're good on those.

DanielRatherman wrote:

Got the side and backsprites done.

Looks like its about to molest some woman with large melons.

Those are old, they were updated to look more borg-y:



Literal hugbot to appease all the people who couldn't git gud.

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Incomptinence wrote:"Don't wanna make it too scary looking or bed wetting babies will declare it invincible,"

whined the silicon-baby.

Seems we need to have a kleenex box for a borg module for all these antags who couldn't git gud.

Why the no-stun rule? Stunning people, then dragging them away, is the number-one best way to stop them getting in a fight.

Because that's one of the things people bitched and moaned about with old secborgs. I'd prefer to preemptively avoid the whining by eliminating any form of stun. Plus, we want to avoid any association with secborgs.

Davidchan wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Incomptinence wrote:"Don't wanna make it too scary looking or bed wetting babies will declare it invincible,"

whined the silicon-baby.

Seems we need to have a kleenex box for a borg module for all these antags who couldn't git gud.

That's actually a pretty good idea.

"Issue Detected: Dispensing Tissue"

Zilenan91 wrote:How about we all just stop talking about secborgs and move on with our lives

We wish you'd just stop talking.

Sec borg wasn't the problem, people just wanting easy mode antag is.

I don't think we'll need any new sprites for the items/modules. Bola launcher can use the DRAGNET sprite, flash already exists, sedative injector can just be a syringe, the holobarrier projector that engineering and security have can be recycled for the barrier, HARM ALARM! can use the honkblaster sprite, and the cookie is just a cookie

Few things.

1. I support this idea a lot. Getting rid of secborgs left a bit of a void in the silicons' collective heart because unless you choose the useless standard module, the only weapon you have against preventing harm - A SILICON'S NUMBER ONE LAW AND PURPOSE - is asking really nicely for it to stop. Okay, maybe this idea isn't perfect, but unless one of us comes up with something else to fill that void, I fully support putting this in the game. Besides, I love the idea of being the cute little peacekeeper I usually am, but with actual weapons to combat harm instead of beeping and pinging and asking nicely for it to stop. Make borgs great again 25somethingsomething
2. I personally think the borg should be white with light blue or seafoam green highlights, not blue. I'm thinking a breed between the aesthetics of Luke's and John's designs, but maybe with a little bit of the shape of a secborg to keep it from swooping down the uncanny valley. I don't want to be bola-molested by a blue goblin when I'm greytiding.
3. Keep in mind that there is never any harm in at least trying something like this. Best case scenario, we get a new borg that people might even love. Worst case scenario, we scrap it and keep the standard module the hero the station deserves.

The drugs injector should probably be a hypo so they aren't utterly pointless against the hard suited. Also every module needs at least some melee drugs can't kill space carps.

Incomptinence wrote:The drugs injector should probably be a hypo so they aren't utterly pointless against the hard suited. Also every module needs at least some melee drugs can't kill space carps.

Should be able to beat carp to death with the cookie dispenser, then.

...

Unrelatedly, I was thinking about "harm prevention" and "padding" and thought, why the fuck don't we have riot foam.
Not metal foam, something quick-hardening, something that sticks to people, (damn near?) immobilises them, and takes them a few seconds to break out of.
I guess I'll make a proposal for a break-action 4ßmm grenade launcher for sec packing this, tear gas, smoke, and flashbangs, maybe with frag shells being locked behind fuckifiknowmaybecargo.

We already have a grenade launcher in code.

It works fine, though apparently was causing some runtime issues??? which was used as an excuse to remove it.

The drug injector should definitely function as a hypo. The riot foam idea sounds cool, definitely something this borg should have if a working grenade launcher is ever added.

So secborg but with worse tools for the job? Equipment worse than the things assistants can make in the tool storage?

You know that the point of cyborgs is to be highly efficient at their role?

The secborg and the peacekeeper borg both server very different functions. Secborgs were designed to function as security, while these borgs are designed with the sole intention of preventing direct harm. Secborgs should have followed their fucking laws, but they didn't. If we can't resolve it though policy, this is the best way. There is no way for these guys to play sec.

You realize Security's job is to maintain peace and not to DM antags?

What's to stop players from playing the standard borg and doing better then what you are trying to put in?

Luke Cox wrote: Secborgs should have followed their fucking laws, but they didn't. If we can't resolve it though policy, this is the best way. There is no way for these guys to play sec.

Maybe they were because they didn't all get job banned?

I mean the every silicon player must be shit because I hate their role angle is pretty flimsy.

yackemflam wrote:What's to stop players from playing the standard borg and doing better then what you are trying to put in?

How about instead of taking poor little criminals to security we just encourage borgs to roofie them then lock them in obscure rooms! Peacekeeper borg would be better at that!

Incomptinence wrote:

yackemflam wrote:What's to stop players from playing the standard borg and doing better then what you are trying to put in?

How about instead of taking poor little criminals to security we just encourage borgs to roofie them then lock them in obscure rooms! Peacekeeper borg would be better at that!

Or you can just stun them for a maximum of three times while you drag them off to dorms or something.
Plenty of times to throw the harmful guy away from the victim.

Alternatively, you can just stun the HARM and drag the victim away from the HARM.

Valid criticisms, and I agree, but it's extremely unlikely that secborgs are ever coming back. What I'm proposing is the most potent law 1-enforcement borg I could think of that wouldn't make people throw a bitch fit. The design is a not so subtle "fuck you" to everyone who couldn't deal with secborgs, and to the admins who wouldn't punish people who broke their laws.

Scott wrote:You realize Security's job is to maintain peace and not to DM antags?

literally laughing so hard I'm crying

Davidchan wrote:

Zilenan91 wrote:How about we all just stop talking about secborgs and move on with our lives

We wish you'd just stop talking.

Sec borg wasn't the problem, people just wanting easy mode antag is.

No, we wish YOU would just stop talking.

People like you are the problem.

See? I can spout meme "arguments" too.

Scott wrote:You realize Security's job is to maintain peace and not to DM antags?

Excuse me, when was the last time you played on /tg/?

Scott wrote:You realize Security's job is to maintain peace and not to DM antags?

Implying those things don't go hand in hand


(you're also wrong, security aren't peace officers they're corporate goons there to protect the company's interests)

Cyborgs have laws and they are not corporate goons, secborg is not security.

Yes, but you were talking about security's role.

Mal is right, sec is comprised of corporate goons who's primary objective is to safeguard NT's interests. By design, security is the primary force working against the antagonists. Borgs, however, are not supposed to actively work against antagonists. Their primary job, unless their laws are changed, is to prevent harm. Often times, this runs directly counter to security's efforts. I agree that secborgs were a policy issue, but if people can't follow their goddamn laws and admins won't enforce them, we need to redesign the secborg in a way that discourages validhunting.

Luke Cox wrote:if people can't follow their goddamn laws and admins won't enforce them, we need to redesign the secborg in a way that discourages validhunting.

or we could just not have secborgs in any variation, which so far has proven good for the game

The issue with removing secborgs entirely is that the AI has few to no tools to prevent human harm from other humans. The engiborg can prevent environmental harm, the mediborg can treat harm, but if a human is chasing another human down with an esword, all the AI can do is yell at sec to stop it. Originally, the secborg was meant to fill this role. Instead, people took it as a license to validhunt rather than work to neutralize harmful individuals. Peacekeeper borgs are meant to provide the AI with borgs that can stop harmful individuals without playing mall cop.

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Luke Cox wrote:if people can't follow their goddamn laws and admins won't enforce them, we need to redesign the secborg in a way that discourages validhunting.

or we could just not have secborgs in any variation, which so far has proven good for the game

Except the AI can't do it's primary job of preventing harm

just go standard borg, baton and drag the shit bag to the brig or bolt him in the dorm forever.

Yeah seriously though, the standard borg, shittiest module, is better than this thing merely by having just it's stunbaton. It's hysterical how you guys are making a hugbot for a secbot replacement.

It can turn off all the lights and try and lock people apart to make it harder to harm each other but now it's not a deciding factor in every interaction where one human punches another. Both of the humans involved get more agency in deciding the matter while the AI still has worthwhile tools (doors, lights, standard borg) to dissuade harm.

newfren wrote:It can turn off all the lights and try and lock people apart to make it harder to harm each other but now it's not a deciding factor in every interaction where one human punches another. Both of the humans involved get more agency in deciding the matter while the AI still has worthwhile tools (doors, lights, standard borg) to dissuade harm.

If the AI has to jump though that many hoops to keep somebody from bashing somebody else's face in with a crowbar, something is very wrong.

ShadowDimentio wrote:It's hysterical how you guys are making a hugbot for a secbot replacement.

thatsthejoke.jpg

ShadowDimentio wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:

Luke Cox wrote:if people can't follow their goddamn laws and admins won't enforce them, we need to redesign the secborg in a way that discourages validhunting.

or we could just not have secborgs in any variation, which so far has proven good for the game

Except the AI can't do it's primary job of preventing harm

that's only when it's on asimov and that gets changed every other round. it also still definitely can prevent harm (opening doors to get people away from a breach to space, bolting antags away), it just can't actively validhunt for antags.

>Gets changed every other round

That's a damn lie. I played AI a fuckload between the repeated AI bans and I recall having my laws changed away from ASIMOV maybe under ten times, and modified under ASIMOV only a bit more than that.

Also what is with your vendetta against AIs actively preventing harm like their laws ORDER them to, did you get dunked once by a borg and never forgive them or what

ShadowDimentio wrote:>Gets changed every other round

That's a damn lie. I played AI a fuckload between the repeated AI bans and I recall having my laws changed away from ASIMOV maybe under ten times, and modified under ASIMOV only a bit more than that.

Also what is with your vendetta against AIs actively preventing harm like their laws ORDER them to, did you get dunked once by a borg and never forgive them or what

nigga
>be a round that isn't traitor (nuke ops wizard shadowling w/e)
>laws instachanged to make nuke ops/wizards/thralls valid
if you don't think this happens you don't play enough

>AIs actively preventing harm like their laws ORDER them to
this is shit, always has been shit, and definitely needs to change if shitters like you keep interpreting it that way. AI should be a neutral third party, not an actively all-seeing validhunter. ideally the way this would be interpreted is "I have a knife. Should I stab that man? No." and "That man has a knife and is currently stabbing that man, and the man is calling for my help. Should I interfere? Yes." Interpreting it as "VALIDS GOTTA GETEM" is fun exclusively for the AI and makes the round worse for literally everybody else.

>"between the repeated AI bans"
nice argument you got there, buddy

PK, are you literally saying that the AI shouldn't stop harmful people? I'm serious, your argument is making no fucking sense. If you're sick of AIs and borgs validhunting, you should be for this. The worst this borg can do is make people stumble around. Just enough to let their victim run to medbay and scream for help on the radio.

PKPenguin321 wrote:nigga
>be a round that isn't traitor (nuke ops wizard shadowling w/e)
>laws instachanged to make nuke ops/wizards/thralls valid
if you don't think this happens you don't play enough

Tfw my lived experiences are invalid in the face of PKP's wild conjecture

Feels bad man

ShadowDimentio wrote:

PKPenguin321 wrote:nigga
>be a round that isn't traitor (nuke ops wizard shadowling w/e)
>laws instachanged to make nuke ops/wizards/thralls valid
if you don't think this happens you don't play enough

Tfw my lived experiences are invalid in the face of PKP's wild conjecture

Feels bad man

>tfw the autismo who can't follow basic asimov and gets banned multiple times for it thinks his "lived experiences" are arbitrarily more valuable than mine

Tfw shifting the focus from my point to mudslinging

B+ effort

>tfw thread has been derailed get back on topic you autistic cucklords

On topic: It should at least have a stunbaton. I know this TOTALLY isn't a discount secborg and we ABSOLUTELY shouldn't bring ANY of it's OVERPOWERED equipment back, but come on it should have SOME type of non-gimmick stun.

Bu- but... muh hugbot...


Seriously though, if we want a shitty stunbaton Borg, we already have the standard model (which can actually do some shit like space exploring but in general is still shit)

The point of this idea is to be gimmick-y but still be effective by not being shit and EXTREME VALID HUNTING

Venticular has it right. In a scenario where an assistant is bashing somebody's face in with a toolbox, the goal of the peacekeeper borg is to get the victim out of there and to protect them from further harm. The borg should flash the attacker to make them drop their weapon, get a shot or two of sedative in if they can, drag the victim away to medbay, and shoot some bolas off if the attacker gives chase. It's security's job to arrest people.

Malkevin wrote:Yes, but you were talking about security's role.

Precisely. Secborgs are being removed because "too good security" when they are not security, they are bound by laws.